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My Vita vs. New 3DS showdown


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#1 BrosBeforeGardenTools

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 08:24 AM

The Vita has a superior clocked CPU. 4 cores at 800MHz or higher vs. 4 New 3DS cores at 268MHz. The individual architectures are actually pretty similar I think.

The Vita has 512MB system RAM and 128MB video RAM. The New 3DS has a still plentiful 256MB system RAM, and 10MB video RAM.

The Vita GPU has a realistic fillrate of 3.2 gigapixels, and the New 3DS GPU has a realistic fillrate of 1 gigapixel. However because the Vita has to process about twice the pixels on the screen, even with 3D enabled on the New 3DS, most of that fillrate will be spent on higher resolution, not higher game complexity.

Game card capacity is similar across both systems.

Vita:

20141119164440-fw_1.jpg

New 3DS:

2640148-xenoblade.jpg

I honestly feel that the Vita is only 50-100% more powerful than the New 3DS. But one thing is for sure. The New 3DS is like a Wii 1, the Vita is a bit under the PS3, especially on CPU.

#2 YoshiGamer9

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 08:33 AM

Hypeeeeeeee

 

Yeah everyone knows the Vita is more powerful than the new 3DS...

 

But you know what the 3DS has over the vita?

 

GAMES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Your agrument is invalid.


Edited by YoshiGamer9, 27 January 2015 - 08:35 AM.

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#3 Hank Hill

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 08:59 AM

Uh...isn't that screenshot just from the Wii version?...


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The post above was certified to be simply smashing by the Wii U Forum Staff.

 

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#4 BrosBeforeGardenTools

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 09:02 AM

Uh...isn't that screenshot just from the Wii version?...


It might be. I had some trouble finding 3DS version.

#5 grahamf

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 09:17 AM

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End of discussion.


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#6 NintendoReport

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 09:21 AM

You may want to change that picture for 3ds. Looks like it's running on dolphin in the shot you posted.

 

Either way it will interesting to see what devs do to take advantage even more of the extra juice in the new 3ds. If you are a spec guy, it's fun to compare specs but at the end of the day it is all about the software (games)

 

NewN3DS_XenobladeChronicles3D_011415_Scr

 

NewN3DS_XenobladeChronicles3D_011415_Scr

 

NewN3DS_XenobladeChronicles3D_011415_Scr


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#7 Raiden

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 09:25 AM

This  comparison is off.Yes the Vita is much more powerful than 3DS. Vita isn't far behind PS3 on many levels. 3DS is Gamecube and Wii sorta with better shaders and other advances. But still a long ways back from Vita. That Xenoblade screen is no doubt the Wii version. Not even worth doing a Screenshot battle. This isn't VGC and it's pointless lets compare PC games to consoles then.

For the record Vita GPU is the same from Ipad 3. 3ds Uses Pica 200 a GPU from from 2005 tweaked. yes 2005.

 

Personally I think the Vita just is a better more thought out system and I don't mean because power alone. The system is immensely easier to and cheaper to develop for than even PSP. Yes PSP. Despite more power. Sony set it up that way to be more open to developers. Falcom confirmed it when Vita was still called NGP. Has a nicer UI and can custom backgrounds and themes more so than 3DS. Nicer to use hold and play.

 

Nintendo kinda sucks at console UI. At least to me. Wii,Wii U and 3DS esp DS. Not used a PS4 yet but Sony is prety good. MS is the worst which is odd.

3DS is just not the DS in terms of variety in games and region locked holds it back a lot for me. Vita is region free. 3DS still from a volume of games has more to choose from and of course Nintendo first party but some none mario/zelda greatness like Fire Emblem. Some 3rd party greatness as well like SMT or Code of Princess. There is a whole lot more. 3DS has more to choose from. I just don't think it has enough for such a successful system. Like no real hidden gems for me. A few scattered interesting 3rd party games and then Kirby/Mario/Zelda and that's kinda sad. Vita has much less to choose from but that is int he west. While my bias for Dragon's Crown and Ys would make Vita a default winner and more Ys this year. Vita being region free has a lot of cool games from Japan. A lot of that Japan hidden gem and quirky to just great games and RPGs. Visual novels. Action games and more. Like you can get a Tenchu like game on Vita or Okami like visuals RPG Oreshika.

 

Sadly yes not in the US strictly but in Japan Vita has far more to offer in variety. Just Sony of the west gave up. Vita will say again is region free can just buy those games. I am still hoping for DQ7 but gave up on Labrynth on 3DS coming to the US. 3DS is a more popular system. better marketed and more popular franchises. Vita has crossplay. Nintendo just now opening up to it.

 

E-Shop is decent on 3DS while Vita offers again much more. Nintendo also seems to think 3DS can only handle NES games or Gameboy. I can buy Legend of Dragoon or Klonoa on Vita and play it on PS3.

 

 

I truly feel Vita IS the better system all around. 3DS is more popular as it has the brand the marketing and more familiar faces. Popularity does not mean better. Much like Wii U is better than PS4.


Edited by Ryudo, 27 January 2015 - 09:39 AM.


#8 Tom

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 11:18 AM

Extra Credits did a video as to why the Vita flopped, which was basically:

 

- The Vita was TOO good. Developing for this thing costed about as much as developing for a console.

 

- Lack of first-party games to establish an install base near the launch, which led to developers being afraid to develop for the thing, which resulted in less games, which resulted in fewer sales, so on and so forth.


Edited by Tom, 27 January 2015 - 11:18 AM.

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#9 3Dude

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 11:31 AM

Oh man. That screenshot comparison is harsh on the vita....


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#10 Raiden

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 12:06 PM

Extra Credits did a video as to why the Vita flopped, which was basically:

 

 Developing for this thing costed about as much as developing for a console.

Factualy inncorrect. My firend is developing on PSVITA and has developed on other systems. It's cheaper than making a game for PSP. There is a reason for this.

Hence everything that works on ps3 works on it, everything that works on ps4 works on it
[12:35:57 PM]  it has free engines like infernal for cross dev
[12:36:26 PM]: theres so many tools that it's common knowledge among devs, even indie ones. even anyone is wary of it you can point to the games on vita that were ported by 1 person in the span of a month if you look up Brian Provinciano he outlines how easy it was to port retro city rampage

 

Note I edited out his name from Skype quote as it was his real name. So edited for privacy purposes. He is a inactive member here as Caviler Games.

 

Like in the other topic mentioned no longer have the bookmark. Falcom Developer of Legend og Heroes and Ys games expressed how it was not just easier but cheaper to develop for on Vita than PSP. Vita is VERY cheap to develop for.

 

What I recall tho is Falcom was more specific about making Ys (then IV later released as Celceta) but still saying what Cav is saying. Extra Credits is wrong.
 

If you notice as an example. Retro City is on 3DS not Wii U. Be harder to put on Wii U while PS3 and Vita was super easy.


Edited by Ryudo, 27 January 2015 - 12:08 PM.


#11 3Dude

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 12:13 PM

Factualy inncorrect. My firend is developing on PSVITA and has developed on other systems. It's cheaper than making a game for PSP. There is a reason for this.
Note I edited out his name from Skype quote as it was his real name. So edited for privacy purposes. He is a inactive member here as Caviler Games.
 
Like in the other topic mentioned no longer have the bookmark. Falcom Developer of Legend og Heroes and Ys games expressed how it was not just easier but cheaper to develop for on Vita than PSP. Vita is VERY cheap to develop for.
 
What I recall tho is Falcom was more specific about making Ys (then IV later released as Celceta) but still saying what Cav is saying. Extra Credits is wrong.


That is true, for porting, and smaller indie projects.

But what was probably being referred to was the fact the Vita had enough power, that if you were to create a full size original game, the money it would take to employ the amount of people, and use the time it takes to create the high quality assets the system is capable of using at its best (models, textures, effects, sounds, music...) would be more akin to creating a console game now, than making a psp game would have been during the ps3/psp era.

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#12 Raiden

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 12:16 PM

That is true, for porting, and smaller indie projects.

But what was probably being referred to was the fact the Vita had enough power, that if you were to create a full size original game, the money it would take to employ the amount of people, and use the time it takes to create the high quality assets the system is capable of using at its best (models, textures, effects, sounds, music...) would be more akin to creating a console game now, than making a psp game would have been during the ps3/psp era.

This applies to both. Hence why it was said anything on PS3/PS4 can run on Vita and in reverse. Falcom is Making a Ys game for both PS4 AND Vita at the same time. Same game. Maybe Ys8 or Ys5 we can't figure that one out yet. Sony set it up this way long long ago before indies were even a glint in Vitas eye. The tools and software allow it to be much simpler and cheaper for anyone. Indie or est developer. The devkits are the same. The tools are the same.



#13 3Dude

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 12:53 PM

This applies to both. Hence why it was said anything on PS3/PS4 can run on Vita and in reverse. Falcom is Making a Ys game for both PS4 AND Vita at the same time. Same game. Maybe Ys8 or Ys5 we can't figure that one out yet. Sony set it up this way long long ago before indies were even a glint in Vitas eye. The tools and software allow it to be much simpler and cheaper for anyone. Indie or est developer. The devkits are the same. The tools are the same.


While thats true for expediating code and engine creation times...

That means nothing to the cost of creating art assets, and pointing out that can be mitigated by basically ignoring the vita as a system with original content in favor of cutting costs by using the same assets as the ps4 game (which is no where NEAR the fidelity of full scale ps4 game) is purposefully not engaging the point.

ORIGINAL Vita games can be console expensive because the vita is powerful enough to use high end assets closer to ps3 games.

There is no magic pill to make human beings creating original art cheaper.

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#14 Raiden

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 01:24 PM

Apologies if this sounds like a cop out. I extended myself here. You are right to a fair degree but not getting the whole picture. I don't wanna quote a crapload from skype. Also looks silly to do so. He's pretty busy not much a forum guy he may or may not respond. So I will have to let this rest. Apologies. Just will say he was able to expand on what you just said in good detail from his own game to when he worked on Max Payne 3.

 

 

I have to bowe out. :( I over extended myself here.



#15 3Dude

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 04:47 PM

Apologies if this sounds like a cop out. I extended myself here. You are right to a fair degree but not getting the whole picture. I don't wanna quote a crapload from skype. Also looks silly to do so. He's pretty busy not much a forum guy he may or may not respond. So I will have to let this rest. Apologies. Just will say he was able to expand on what you just said in good detail from his own game to when he worked on Max Payne 3.
 
 
I have to bowe out. :( I over extended myself here.


Okay, no I dont think its a cop out at all, and if you dont want to come back to this I understand.

But, I do GET the whole picture, I totally know what you are talking about, and its a great thing, Nintendo seems to be doing the same thing by unifying the instruction architecture of their next systems, I sing the same praises you are singing now.

What I couldnt figure out at first is why you were focusing so much on that part of the picture and ignoring the other part, I thought it was ignoring, but seeing your last response, I think you just honestly had good faith in these devs, that they would be making thse games for the vita to be making enjoyable games, that stood by the merit of their content, and that the cost to do that wasnt that expensive at all. Which is why you brought up the people and games that you did.

But those people ARE making games for the Vita. He was very specifically talking about all the people who decided NOT to make games for the Vita, in particular, the AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA homogenous poop treadmill third parties.

The problem they had with the Vita, was that in order to make the kind of game theyve indoctrinated their audience to buy without question while ignoring everything else, they would need to dump a metric butt ton of cash into the asset creation side to make a game with visualproduction values their audience is conditioned to respond too. The people you are bringing up, the people who make strong gameplay centric games, for them the stronger tools and power of the vita makes it MUCH easier AND cheaper to make games for than the psp... Those people CAN NOT afford to make games with those production values (This was done on purpose by large publisher incumbents over the past 2 gens to destroy the mid tier, stifling the impact of innovation to make the market easier to milk. Kept 'minecrafts' from happening)

So those guys, the third party AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA crappers, arent making games, they are making obnoxiously slick roller coaster rides. They need the most expensive assets, the most expensive textures, the most expensive vo, the most expensive cinematic qte events, the trigger points they conditioned their audience to immediately respond to, and purposefully placed outside of the resource capabilities of mid tier studios like Falcom. They dont give a rainbow about the game, just the crap they can market to LOOK like an amazing adventure in screenshots and video clips.

To do that on vita, thanks to its classy graphical capabilities, would cost nearly as much as making a high end ps3 game, and then they would have to MARKET it the AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA way, which would cost several times more than it cost to make the game itself.

Its also similar to the reason they dont support the 3ds, despite it being the most lucrative dedicated games system in existence right now. Theyve conditioned their audience to not respond to things below a certain production value threshold.

The problem is, their brainwashed audience didnt pick up the vita in quantities large enough to make that business model a guaranteed return of investment. So of COURSE they werent going to take a risk on making a game for the vita. They wouldnt even think past the oppurtunity cost of making a game for vita. One original game that may or may not be a hit on vita was taking almost the same asset creation resources of a guaranteed to sell ps3/360/ps4/xbone AAAAAAAAA factory line game.

THOSE are the third parties being talked about, who wouldnt release a game on the vita to even ATTEMPT to grow an audience, because of the actual cost, and the oppurtunity cost. They also happen to directly coincide with the cancer that is destroying the industry. (Not a coincidence).

So, in summary, you were talking about honest devs who wanted to make the kinds of games they enjoyed, make them great, and hope people enjoy them.

He was talking about why poop head jerk pants who peddle skinner box crap fests slathered in snake oil skipped the system. It was because they are poop head jerk pants snake oil salesmen.

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#16 Son Edo

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 05:26 PM

Vita is a really good system, great hardware, there's honestly nothing bad you could say about it. Unfortunately Sony and Devs just aren't supporting it.

 

Like Ryudo, I thinks it's the better system.



#17 3Dude

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 06:13 PM

Vita is a really good system, great hardware, there's honestly nothing bad you could say about it. Unfortunately Sony and Devs just aren't supporting it.
 
Like Ryudo, I thinks it's the better system.


Hardware wise its a spectacular little system.

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#18 Son Edo

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 12:10 AM

Indeed, but it falls flat on it's face software wise.



#19 Chronos21

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 07:00 AM

3Dude, your post reminds me the 3DS MGS3 demo from E3 2010. It looked so nice and all we got now is a PS2 port. But these AAA atidude from devs and publishers need to stop really :( I think, if they arent changing some things, this will lead to a crash.

#20 NintendoReport

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 07:04 AM

So, do we think Sony will bother with another handheld after the vita?


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