MorbidGod

It's refreshing to hear Nintendo is supporting developers. I would like to know these details he can't tell us. Which brings me to only one possible question: Why is ot secret? What is Nintendo doing that they think MS and Sony aren't?

I don't think that a 3D game is necessarily better than a platformer but when I heard that we could have had a Metroid instead of a Donkey Kong platformer I was very disappointed but that's just my personal opinion. Everyone believes that Donkey Kong will sell better than Metroid would, but I certainly won't be running out to buy it until a price cut.

It's looking at the past. If Metroid was such a system seller, then it would have sold 5 million or more. But it didn't even sell 2 million. DK sold over five million copies. Usually, that's a sign of good things for the sequel of that game. It doesn't apply if the game sucked but from what I'm told it did not suck. So people bought it, people enjoyed it, and your trying to say those ppl won't want an HD DK game?

Hope you right but with 3d land and dktf you have to remember both are letdown titles. Everyone on here was oh Retro is going blow minds and sow what the Wii U is about with graphics and how the 3d mario would be a show stopper... And neither of those things happen and we have these two games to thank for that.

The people on this forum, aren't really the people who played and loved the previous titles. Yes, I do admit people wanted something else from Retro -- but case in point, not a single Metroid game has EVER outsold DK Country Returns on Wii from Retro. Not even the Prime games. Same with Other M. And Mario 3D Land was a good game, and people loved it. It outsold MG2 and nearly outsold MG1. People where just expecting a Galaxy 3. But remember the rule of thumb -- people don't go out of there way to say good things. The loudest people are the ones complaining.

I could be wrong -- but numbers is what businesses go by. Looking at the numbers, of course these choices are the natural choices.

Letdown titles to whom? People on these boards, many of whom already own a Wii U? Many who will buy a Wii U this holiday season probably didn't even watch the Nintendo Direct or follow E3.

Monolith Soft and Platinum games showed flashy graphics.

Exactly. That was another point I totally missed upon my original response. Amen!

I remember being a teenager seeing windwaker after that demo they showed and being revel in the beautiful sunshineed. I didn't biy windwaker and never played it. You don't think there are teenagers wanting a *2013* 1st party game from Nintendo to show off to their friends who will be buying a ps4 and xb1? They are disappointed believe me I've seen enough post on the nintendo E3 community on Mii verse. I told people not to get their hopes up with Retro. Nintendo lives on another planet they don't realize you have to sell and hype a console and give the "core" what they want sometimes. Like I said for a company that said they were going after the core and 3rd parties would be on the console... They are doing a horrible job. We should of had f-zero instead of wario ware.

You are missing the point.

http://www.vgchartz....-mario-3d-land/

Over 8 million people bought the Mario 3D Land game.

http://www.vgchartz....mario-galaxy-2/

Under 8 million people bought the last Galaxy game.

Which game, if you were trying to decide which one to make a sequel to, would you choose? The latest Mario game that has over 8 million customers wanting a sequel, and a brand that is loosing customers? And with Galaxy people weren't really asking for new features -- with Mario 3D Land the biggest complaint is that you can't play with your friends. That is in this title with the Wii U. So not only are you getting all these extra features -- like being able to see in the tunnels and the game is in HD -- but you are getting the one feature you want. (bare in mind "you" are the customer of 3D Land). In every single way, this game has improved upon an original, successful formula.

And most of these 3DS Owners HAVE NOT purchased a Wii U. May not even know what a Wii U is. How do I know this? Wii U hasn't sold over 8 million units yet. I said this before E3 -- and apparently Nintendo listened (probably knew) -- Nintendo does not need to go after the Playstation or Xbox gamer. They aren't going to win those people. They need to go after the 30+ million 3DS owners who actively play their device and love it. That's what they are doing with Mario 3D World.

As far as Donkey Kong, as I said previously, Donkey Kong for Retro did better than any other previous title they worked on. Not every customer who purchased that on the Wii has purchased a Wii U -- how do I know? Easy, Wii U has not sold over 5 million units yet. Nintendo needs to go after those fans -- hey, you have no Wii U? You love Donkey Kong? Buy Wii U and get new HD Donkey Kong!

Guess what that equals? NEW CUSTOMERS. It would even be a HUGE score if those DK fans aren't the Mario fans from 3DS. In truth, some crossover, but not all.

This is not including the millions of Sonic fans on other platforms who will probably end up buying Sonic Lost World and maybe even Donkey Kong along with it (obviously snatching up a Wii U). Because Sonic fans want to play Sonic games. And Sonic games usually sell 1 - 3 million units. So Sega isn't explecting 5+ million units sold on that game. So it is VERY possible that more Sonic games will be exclusive to Nintendo platforms and that will only mean more people buying a Wii U. And once they do, they will eventually look for other games -- and that's what this is all about. Thats when third parties try to get the scraps. Because people buy Nintendo platforms for Nintendo games. So third parties are just forcing their games for a Nintendo customer. Some work out well -- Raymen is a natural fit. Watch Dogs I believe for the Wii U is a natural fit because of the controls style and the game. But I think in part for EA that is the problem -- Nintendo gamers don't care for their games. [I]And sales back that up.[\I]

If EA is smart -- and hopefully they are -- the next Mario and Sonic Olympic Game EA will co-develop. Think about it -- EA experience in sports games, and working with Nintendo -- EA will get more money. Same with any other Mario sport title.

But all of this depends on Nintendo getting their customers. They have customers, and they need to cater to them. Forget the other gamers for now. Just get the numbers, because that's what some publishers need (like Ubisoft).

AND REMEMBER HERE ... the Key word is forget the other gamers FOR NOW. Yes, eventually, you will need to branch out for them. But right now Nintendo can not reach for them. They don't have a user base. Nintendo has said OVER and OVER their job as a first party developer is to push the user base. Fighting a fight for customers who want multiplatform games and third party developers making less of those for you aren't going to help you. Catering to them and making them say "Wow those graphics are awesome on that Metroid game." isn't going to make them choose Wii U over PS4 when Wii U is not getting Battlefield 4 this year. Or The Crew. Or The Division. Or ... input third party game not coming to Wii U.

So, if you can't provide games for those customers, why go after them? Nintendo can provide games to customers who want THEIR games. And that is what they need to FOCUS on FIRST.

EDIT: And Remember, those gamers who like CoD and Battlefied and Destiny and Halo aren't really going to buy Metroid. It didn't happen for GCN (when graphics where on par with Halo). It didn't happen with Wii. Why do you think it will for Wii U? The definition of insanity is believing doing the same thing over and over will create a different result. Metroid isn't a franchise that can compete with Halo and those games. Halo 3 sold over 11 million games. One one platform. Metroid Prime 3 and Other M both sold under 2 million units. And many Xbox 360 owners had a Wii360 combo. Microsoft advertised that as, "Sure, buy the Wii. But buy us for all the core games." and that's what people did.

Honestly, if you want a Halo killer on the Wii U, Nintendo will need a new IP. And I believe Miyamoto is working on that game. He has said in the past he wants to make a First Person Shooter. A "Halo" killer from him would be AMAZING. Hopefully he is working on said game and we will see it soon. But he is busy helping all of Nintendo make better games and teaching the young developers. Which is important too.

Thats a common arguement, but EA is pretty much banking on the PS4/X1 taking off alot quicker than the Wii U has thus far.  Not to mention that EA's games typically have a lower attach ratio on Nintendo hardware than Sony or Microsofts hardware.  EA is going to want to be confident that their highest profile games will sell at least 500k on the Wii U before they will come back to it.

Which, Xbox One and PS4 sales will slow whenever there drought happens. At some point, there won't be new games and everyone who wanted the launch titles has them.

The only questions is when will that happen.

In time we shall see but... We shouldn't get any hopes up. I'm gonna do my best to support ubi. Splinter cell, AC4, and watchdogs I will buy and support. I'm still just beside myself the negative mindset it seems most developers and publishers have for this console. Never seen anything like this in all my days of gaming. Nintendo has a BIG hole to climb out of and not having MK8 released this year was a mistake... It was a guarnatee system seller. I'm not sure If 3d world and DKTF is gonna do the job.

I think 3D World and DKTF will help sell tremendously. I mean, I know that every DK fan who bought the Wii version hasn't bought a Wii U. Why? Wii U hasn't sold five million copies. Same with 3D Land. Wii U hasn't sold 8+ million units. And guess what the biggest complaint is with 3D Land? Multiplayer. There is a post somewhere in the E3 forum stating when he got home all his kids can talk about is how awesome these two games are. That father - if he hadn't bought a Wii U yet - would just to play Mario with his kids. I'm buying Mario for that purpose. Guess what? His kids didn't care about Mario Kart. They have Sonic Racing.

Now, with that said, Mario Kart will sell bazzillions of Wii U's. That's a big reason why I think The Crew will get on Wii U. But, not having it this year won't kill Nintendo. They can - with Sonic Lost World, Sonic and Mario Winter Games, Pikman 3, DK, Mario 3D World alone sell enough Wii Us to get nine million at the end of the year. WHICH IS GOOD. The key is to let people know about it.

Well, I can actually respect these comments, and I feel they are accurate.  Even Shin'en commented that the way you code for Wii U to get the best performance was a lot different than on 360 and PS3.  The Wii U leans very heavily on the edram on the GPU and the cache on the CPU.  There is no way a PC'ish game engine would every run very well on a propriety design like the Wii U.  Basically, they will put the work in if the market makes sense, but right now it just doesnt.  Im just glad they were big enough to come out and say why.  All the insinuations about the Wii U not being powerful enough were misleading, the architecture is the main thing holding back the engine.  With the proper work done, the engine could be tailored to work well on the system.

Exactly. That was my biggest complaint. They were lying just to make it look like Nintendo was the bad guy. Well, the only thing Nintendo did was make there system unique.

I just hope Nintendo never used x86. If I'm going to buy a console I want unique hardware I can't build.

This is what I been saying. And 3Dude. And others. EA doesn't have the resources or the reason to spend what it doesn't have. Wii U is different and takes work. However, if Wii U does meet the nine million user base - which it easily could this year - than EA will want to take advantage of that. And they will. Hopefully, If that happens, Nintendo supports them.

The WiiU is not powerful enough to keep up with the X1 or PS4, the WiiU will have games that look as good as the first X1/PS4 games but they will soon pull away, they have much more power, it makes no difference how you spin it, the X1 & PS4 have more power than the WiiU, the WiiU would of stood a much better chance if it had 4GB or RAM & 1GB of dedicated for the system.

The first party games have been delayed until 2014.

People keep going on about how rubbish COD & FIFA are & that they are the same things over & over again but the same can be said for Mario & Zelda, every gen another Mario & Zelda etc game is rolled out, now you may not like COD or FIFA but they sell consoles, & i have no doubt that COD is the biggest online multiplayer game being played on the WiiU.

The WiiU needs a proper hardcore FPS & also a proper driving game, now not in a few years, having GTA5 would've helped a huge amount to.

No the WiiU doesn't have the mini game-disc like the GameCube had but it still uses a priority disc system.

People that do not already have a WiiU are not interested in a getting a WiiU, they are more interested in getting either a PS4 or X1 & they are saving their money for that.

I would think that the PS4 & X1 will have a bigger install base than the WiiU does six months after release, the other thing is that Sony & Microsoft are going to back their consoles to the hilt & they have said that they are looking at another long cycle, are Nintendo backing the WiiU well yes but at E3 we only heard about games we already know about & some of these were pushed back from a 2013 release to a 2014 release, come Autumn everyone will be playing GTA5 & waiting for the PS4 & X1 to be released, where the WiiU will have Pikmin 3 !

I don't think Nintendo can turn the WiiU's fortunes away, the third party developers have two excuses, not a big enough install base & the machine is not powerful enough, now without more games sales won't rise & then you have the work of getting PS4/X1 games running on the WiiU, RAM is the key it always has been, the WiiU doesn't have enough, the code cannot be forced through it is that simple.

The WiiU is just going to end up as a console for Mario & Zelda, many people myself included have had enough of spending hundreds of pounds/dollars/euros on a full console just to play a handful of games, that in effect we have played before.

If i hadn't already got a WiiU i wouldn't buy one.

As for a WiiU2 in a few years, that will kill it, people who bought a WiiU will not be happy at all for a start & it still won't have the third party support either, why spend £300/$300 on a WiiU2 when you will be able to play the games on your X1/PS4 ?

Um, what the hell are you talking about dude. I'm tired of going back and forth on this. And some of these topic you mentioned just are plain wrong.

First off, I'm not spinning anything. Look at X. Look at Bayonnetta 2. Look at Mario Kart 8. These games aren't possible on old generation and when it comes to X nothing I saw on PS4 is better than that. The same quality? Sure. But Wii U is capable of next generation graphics. They proved that with X. Hell, LOOK at Watch Dogs on Wii U. Graphics are great too.

Second, not a single game has been delayed until 2014. Pikman 3, Wonderful 101 and Wii Fit U all were delayed and will be released in 2013. The first two way before end of 2013. X, Bayonnetta 2, Mario Kart 8 and SSB4 had no official release date before E3 2013 and can't be considered as a delay. It's called we now know when they are being released. At least the year.

Third, Pikman 3, NSLBU, Wonderful 101, Donkey Kong, Mario 3D World, Sonic Lost World, Watch Dogs, Splinter Cell, Batman is coming on 2013. Most of those exclusives. So while people are playing CoD I will be busy playing Wonderful 101, DK, Sonic and Mario. I'll also be playing Watch Dogs and I'll probably be getting Batman and I'll even give Splinter Cell a try.

Finally, there are people who won't get a Wii U until that one exclusive title comes. That could be Wonderful 101. That could be Pikman 3. That could be Donkey Kong. That could be Mario 3D World. That could be Sonic Lost World. In terms of Mario, that has over 8 million fans from 3DS who wanted multiplayer and many of the other upgrades. Plus there are new players who want the game (like me). Imagine 1 million current Wii U owners and 8 million 3DS (new Wii U owners) buying Mario 3D World (and Wii U). That would be over 8 million new console owners. For one freaking game. Imagine another five million who loved Donkey Kong on Wii and hadn't bought a Wii U yet. That could easily add anywhere from one to five million new owners too Wii U.

See how this can add up. Nintendo can turn this around. And, if they manage 9 million owners by the end of the year -- they are at the same number of sales PS3 had at there 13th month mark. Which ended up selling 70+ million units. Was the PS3 a failure? Maybe was last place, but 70 million sells is a hell of a lot of sales. And Sony went beyond 70 million.

So, if Sony can turn a bad start, and Nintendo can turn it around with the 3DS (WHICH WAS ON THE SAME SITUATION), Then Wii U can do well.

Because on your 3DS, you can't really play 2 player co-op or local multiplayer without having 2 3ds's and 2 games, so they even it out with having a multiplayer on it, but with the console you can play with 4 other people so they tried to even it out.

Still, it should be an option for Wii U. Oh well, I'm still buying this, Donkey Kong, Mario, Wonderful 101 and Pikman day one.

Good post. Honestly, the only reason I had any interest in the Wii u was BC I thought my gf's five year old was getting one and it turned out just to be a Wii. I thought it looked cool enough so I got one. I didn't even really play my Wii.

I think mobile and tablets have cut into consoles- so maybe the need isn't obvious enough to upgrade for most when you can get games at 1/10 the price or even free. Maybe that's why Nintendo took the chance on the gamepad

Yeah, it is a good idea. They need to utilize it more, and they haven't. It's sad ZombiU is the only game showing how that screen is best used.

R.I.P. Wii U.

R.I.P Xbox One

See? I can say something off topic too. This has nothing to do with Wii U dying, or Ubisoft taking support away. They simply made the game available for platforms that have more gamers. Did you see Rayman Legands on PS4 or Xbox One?

So again, R.I.P PS4.

See what I did there?

Square is just mad that X looks amazing.

And who is Brando?

Son of Desert Punk?

Square: Wii U can't deliver DirectX 11! Wii no support U!

Monolith: Look at X. It blows your KH3 out of the water!

Square: OMGZ! You totally pawned us!

lol jk. It, like all things, probably will be more about money then anything else.

Well, until I read the whole quote, I question what he means. Is there a specific feature the Wii U lacks that they need? Pas4 doesn't support DirectX 11, and since this isn't an Xbox One exclusive, that can't be a reason. Or is it that Wii U uses Power ISA? Or, maybe by appropriate he meant something else. Until u see the full quote, though, it's hard to say.

I understand that completely. However, this happens in virtually every market. Ever heard of Garage Sales? Does the maker of the clothing you buy get any money then? What about those toy makers? I just sold my tablet I didn't want any more. Did HP get any money from that sale? What about used CD sales? Used movie sales? What about a store like goodwill, that sells all used items?

If you make something, it's going to get sold at some point. Assuming said item isn't digital (like downloading a game). Really, Microsoft could focus more on people buying digital games and the problem would be solved. If you buy a disc, it's yours. But if you buy digitally, then it's not able to be traded or sold. I would even make those digital games cheaper, and raise the cost of physical games.

That would be acceptable to me. But trying to change a paradigm that has been around for literally as long as ppl been selling product is just wrong.

They should price at a regular price game, but have a fancy case, a special CD with music and something else. Then when the price comes down you remove all those extras.

It means that they just played it safe and announced predictable games. Super Mario 3D World looks good but it should have been a Galaxy sequel, Rare working on another Donkey Kong was disappointing, Smash Bros and Mario Kart coming out in 2014. Basically they barely announced any game changers that will make people buy a Wii U.

I have a problem with the last statement. They didn't announce any surprise at E3, but they did announce a game changer with An Exclusive Partnership with Sega. Which means three exclusive Sonic games. Two of those games are known, and the last Mario and Sonic games sold many units, which those fans will obviously want the new one and to do that ... They need a Wii U.

The last exclusive Sonic game sold on Wii over one million, and same on DS. Which, again, assuming at least the Wii owners will want the new Sonic World, that will move Wii U's. And that's not including old Gen PS3 or 360 owners who are looking for Wii U because of Xbox One fiasco.

Donkey Kong on Wii sold more than any other Retro title. It moved over five million units. That was also a surprise, because very few people guess Donkey Kong as the next Retro title. Now you tell me, is a game selling barely 2 million (any Prime game) a better choice then a game that sold over five million? Yes, it's playing it safe. But that is because Nintendo needs to sell units.

Mario 3D Land sold better than Galaxy 2, and almost better than Galaxy 1. At the 13th month mark, it actually did surpass Galaxy. And you know what the biggest feature people wanted from that game? Multiplayer. Guess what the sequel has? Multiplayer. 3DS owners who loved that game will now want to buy a Wii U. And, being a bigger better game with better HD graphics, people like myself will buy this game too. Which means more Wii U's that will have to be sold.

I also believe Pikman 3 will be a big system seller. Enough people wanted it at launch. Same with Wonderful 101.

Playing it safe? Yes. Which means Nintendo is making games they know will sell Wii U's. That's their job, which will get publishers interested to make more games for us.

I'm not saying they didn't play it safe. But they are making games that will sell units and make them money.

Note: Might I also say I wasn't sold on Mario 3D World until I saw the developer interview. And I think my kids will like it too.