21 replies to this topic

[Azure-Edge]

So I've been thinking about Nintendo's current situation with third parties that seem as if they'd rather die than support a Nintendo home console. Now I've seen a lot possible explanations for this. Third party games don't sell on Nintendo systems (I don't buy this. Crap doesn't sell on Nintendo systems. Same as the other two, only difference is that devs know they'll get called out for laziness on a Sony or MS system). The Wii U is too different, it'd be too much work to put their games on it (once again laziness). Third parties don't want to compete against Nintendo's games (this is where it gets interesting). 

 

Now, I don't put THAT much stock in to the whole wanting to avoid competing with Nintendo's software but I'll play devil's advocate here. Whether or not you love Nintendo or hate them, one thing nobody can deny is that Nintendo is without a doubt one of, if not the, biggest game developer/publisher in the business. Any publisher would die to have the sort of collection of IPs that Nintendo has. Therefore it's not exactly a stretch to say that devs and publishers wouldn't be thrilled to have to compete against Nintendo head to head, thus maybe why they don't support Nintendo consoles when they don't have to. 

 

We all know that Nintendo is going through some hard times right now, which is partly due to third parties ignoring their console. Now this is where it gets ironic. There are only two ways things can go for Nintendo. 

1) They don't recover and eventually go third party. Or...

2) They get better and become a much stronger console manufacturer. 

 

With these being the only two ways for Nintendo to go, either way third parties are shooting themselves in the foot. If Nintendo goes third party then the industry now has another EA level publisher with the two highest grossing IPs in gaming history among many others. Now every developer will have to directly compete with Mario, Pokemon, Zelda, Smash Bros., Mario Kart, Metroid, etc. Assuming that Nintendo's quality control of their own games stays as high as it's been, it's going to look really bad on other devs when Nintendo is able to churn out their games without day 1 patches/dlc. People are going to ask why that new Elder Scrolls game is so glitchy when compared to the new Zelda. The bar is gonna be raised on devs.

 

Of course if the second option occurs and Nintendo starts to regain some of their former glory then that's going to leave third parties with no choice but to start sucking up and kissing ass to a company that they've shunned and badmouthed like the plague for years. At that point there's no telling if Nintendo will treat third parties normally or royally give them the finger. 

 

Just my thoughts.

[Ghost]

So I've been thinking about Nintendo's current situation with third parties that seem as if they'd rather die than support a Nintendo home console. Now I've seen a lot possible explanations for this. Third party games don't sell on Nintendo systems (I don't buy this. Crap doesn't sell on Nintendo systems. Same as the other two, only difference is that devs know they'll get called out for laziness on a Sony or MS system). The Wii U is too different, it'd be too much work to put their games on it (once again laziness). Third parties don't want to compete against Nintendo's games (this is where it gets interesting). 

 

 

While the bold part is true to some degree, that is only for the usual suspects like Zelda, Mario, Yoshi, Metroid and Donkey Kong.  I think X, B2 and the Mario Kart series are gonna be problems but no other I.P has done any impact to make Third parties scared to compete with first party Nintendo games.

[LinkKennedy]

It would be bad for the industry for Nintendo to go 3rd party, I think everyone(even Sony/Microsoft fanboys know that) so let's hope that it doesn't get to that point.

Now let's say they did go 3rd party I really doubt people would compare a Zelda to Elder Scrolls simply because their two wholly different styles of games. Both would essentially be great even if one is filled with glitches hence why everyone LOVED Fallout3 or Skyrim. Again I love Nintendo but let's not pretend like their the only company making good games.

[Dankey Kang]

Wow. This post is actually super intelligent. Would you mind if I posted it on my site and gave you credit, or would you be able to guest post it, or something? I REALLY LOVE THIS. PLEASE LET ME KNOW.

[Ghost]

Wow. This post is actually super intelligent. Would you mind if I posted it on my site and gave you credit, or would you be able to guest post it, or something? I REALLY LOVE THIS. PLEASE LET ME KNOW.

 

 

Stealinz, heys!

 

respect my authoritah

[Azure-Edge]

It would be bad for the industry for Nintendo to go 3rd party, I think everyone(even Sony/Microsoft fanboys know that) so let's hope that it doesn't get to that point.

Now let's say they did go 3rd party I really doubt people would compare a Zelda to Elder Scrolls simply because their two wholly different styles of games. Both would essentially be great even if one is filled with glitches hence why everyone LOVED Fallout3 or Skyrim. Again I love Nintendo but let's not pretend like their the only company making good games.

 

Nobody had any issues comparing Skyrim to Skyward Sword (that's where I pulled the example from, along with the fact that Bethesda's games are notorious for glitches). I get what you're saying, they're different kinds of games but they're within the same realm. Games compete with one another regardless of genre anyways. It's not even about comparing those two games specifically, simply that these days it's become quite common for even really big games to be released incomplete and having to be patched from the get go. Nintendo on the other hand, hasn't done that as of yet. I'm not saying that Nintendo is the only one who makes good games at all, it's simply a matter of quality control. 

 

 

Wow. This post is actually super intelligent. Would you mind if I posted it on my site and gave you credit, or would you be able to guest post it, or something? I REALLY LOVE THIS. PLEASE LET ME KNOW.

 

Do what you want man. Makes no difference to me. 

[Dankey Kang]

Nobody had any issues comparing Skyrim to Skyward Sword (that's where I pulled the example from, along with the fact that Bethesda's games are notorious for glitches). I get what you're saying, they're different kinds of games but they're within the same realm. Games compete with one another regardless of genre anyways. It's not even about comparing those two games specifically, simply that these days it's become quite common for even really big games to be released incomplete and having to be patched from the get go. Nintendo on the other hand, hasn't done that as of yet. I'm not saying that Nintendo is the only one who makes good games at all, it's simply a matter of quality control. 

 

 

 

Do what you want man. Makes no difference to me. 

Alright thanks.

[Prince AKR]

Wow; this post really makes a lot of sense.

 

I don't know why third-parties have this beef with Nintendo; it's been this way for years. It's like they always have SOME excuse when it comes down to bringing their game over to a Nintendo system.

 

N64:

"Oh, sorry. It still uses cartridges. Yes, it's powerful, but we like CDs better."

 

GC:

"Woops, sorry again. Those mini-discs just don't cut it for us. Oh, yes, of course it's still more powerful; but those darn mini-discs! We prefer DVDs."

 

Wii:

"No, no, no! It's too weak now!! And that horrid controller!! Yes, we could also make it compatible with the GC Controller and Classic Controller - but we like 720p and hard-drives better!"

 

Wii U:
"That tablet, though! Nope, sorry. That controller may be a little more traditional now, but how could we ever accommodate that screen? Besides, it's not up to par with PS4 or XBOX One anyways. Yeah, it's more powerful than the PS3 and 360, but we still prefer PS4/XBOX One better!"

 

... In all honesty; that's how these good-for-nothing third-parties sound to me. They're lazy and selfish. They treat Nintendo gamers like some kind of lower-class citizens. and throw them the occasional morsel every now and then.

 

On the Wii U scene; it's like devs are now creating excuses not to support the system. EA sabotaged all four releases of the games they currently have on the U. Warner-Bros half-baked Arkham Origins from the start, and now Ubi is only delaying the Wii U version of Watch_Dogs, for who knows how long. And let's not forget that horrid stunt they pulled with Rayman Legends.

 

Seriously, it's terrible now.

Edited by Prince AKR, 16 February 2014 - 08:45 PM.

[Nollog]

That's dumb.

Third parties can't achieve success with Nintendo.

Nintendo buyers don't buy third parties on Nintendo.

Nintendo buyers buy a second machine for third parties.

Third parties lost the ability to sell to Nintendo owners a decade or two ago, when Sony arrived and started making media boxes instead of consoles.

[Merky Water]

So I've been thinking about Nintendo's current situation with third parties that seem as if they'd rather die than support a Nintendo home console. Now I've seen a lot possible explanations for this. Third party games don't sell on Nintendo systems (I don't buy this. Crap doesn't sell on Nintendo systems. Same as the other two, only difference is that devs know they'll get called out for laziness on a Sony or MS system). The Wii U is too different, it'd be too much work to put their games on it (once again laziness).

Most of what I've read points to this.  I think most 3rd parties would rather see nintendo consoles die off so they can make games more easily/cheaply for the other two big consoles who have more or less become carbon copies.  You bring up some good points about wanted them pushed out of hardware to make things easier on them... but then you also point out then nintendo would just make software and i think 3rd parties are smart enough to see that and wouldn't want that either.  I think some 3rd parties are happy enough just doing what they're doing: Delaying games and/or withholding DLC hoping more customers will flock to the ones they can more easily update and won't delay(when they probably need extensively patched out of the gate due to lack of proper testing on ALL platforms), as well as make more 'woe is 3rd party' anonymous leaks about how hard a non-cookie cutter system kit is to develop on.

 

I'll continue to buy third party games who put the effort in on this system.  If a title's delayed, I'll delay my purchase at least as long.  If a title gets parts cut out of the out-of-box game, I'll still buy it, but not until after an equivalent price drop.  My one exception to these rules is games with promising multiplayer.  For some reason, I just can't bring myself to hold off on a game that I know I want to play with my friends day one ie: Call of Duty, Assassins Creed and Need4Speed(if Criterion plays a part).  Not limited to those titles... but that's what I can readily think of.  I have no way to combat if a publisher decides not to put out DLC on a particular system... but I see that as a shortsight on them where an easy profit bonus is thrown by the wayside.

[TheDoctor_13]

Nintendo buyers don't buy third parties on Nintendo.

Nintendo buyers buy a second machine for third parties.

Third parties lost the ability to sell to Nintendo owners a decade or two ago, when Sony arrived and started making media boxes instead of consoles.

 

Not always. I always thought it was stupid for people to buy 2 consoles, or even more. I buy all my third party titles on nintendo systems, if its not on nintendo, i probably wont buy it. 

[3Dude]

Nobody had any issues comparing Skyrim to Skyward Sword (that's where I pulled the example from, along with the fact that Bethesda's games are notorious for glitches). I get what you're saying, they're different kinds of games but they're within the same realm. Games compete with one another regardless of genre anyways. It's not even about comparing those two games specifically, simply that these days it's become quite common for even really big games to be released incomplete and having to be patched from the get go. Nintendo on the other hand, hasn't done that as of yet. I'm not saying that Nintendo is the only one who makes good games at all, it's simply a matter of quality control. 
 
 
 
Do what you want man. Makes no difference to me.

Thats not new man. Its only new to consoles, and only showed up in consoles this last generation.

Elderscrolls, historically, has released buggy as hell. To the point of being completely impossible to finish because of scripting errors in the main quest lines. It took years of patching to get daggerfall to where it is now, and even now, its not a garuntee that the game wont glitch out making your save file worthless and unable to continue the main quest.

Hot off the heels of daggerfall, morrowind released MUCH better, mostly because, it was thousands of times smaller than daggerfall. A trait which has remained ever since, the elderscrolls are still microscopic compared to their ancestors, however, the bugs have returned full force. Joy.

[Nollog]

Not always. I always thought it was stupid for people to buy 2 consoles, or even more. I buy all my third party titles on nintendo systems, if its not on nintendo, i probably wont buy it. 

You're a minority.

[KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

You're a minority.

I'm the same as him.

[Azure-Edge]

I'm the same as him.

 

Ironically I will probably be doing the same this gen. I've grabbed the playstation system along with nintendo since the PS2 but I just don't see it this time with the PS4. Maybe it's because I've found the 3DS to be so good or just because I don't have the time to game like I used to, but either way I think I'll be sticking with just my Wii U and 3DS this gen. (Possibly a Vita if I land this job in Japan.)

[grahamf]

I'm kind of the same too. After having both an Xbox 360 and a PS3 and not being really that interested in the games (not even LittleBigPlanet, which was the primary reason why i got the PS3), I'll be sticking with my Wii U. First party Nintendo games seem to have this constantly high level of quality that just isn't guaranteed in other games. Heck, the Lego Movie Videogame has trouble with it's free play mode that has made it impossible to 100% complete missions.

 

I believe the main reason (and probably the only real reason) why we don't have so many third party games is the expected level of quality. Nintendo from the start has attempted to enforce higher quality in games (which is why the NES saved the videogame industry), and that has left it's userbase kind of spoiled. Third parties have always tried to maximize their margins, and that meant cutting back on quality assurance. This (and no room for cutscene videos on the SNES cartridge) meant that they were effectively locked out of publishing on Nintendo consoles unless they ponied up the cash, and when they did throw a bone they already had a reputation for poor quality (and half-assed ports with missing features didn't help).

 

As of right now, Nintendo is mostly independent of the rest of the Videogame industry. It does need to remind those that left and tell those that don't know this, however.

[KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

Ironically I will probably be doing the same this gen. I've grabbed the playstation system along with nintendo since the PS2 but I just don't see it this time with the PS4. Maybe it's because I've found the 3DS to be so good or just because I don't have the time to game like I used to, but either way I think I'll be sticking with just my Wii U and 3DS this gen. (Possibly a Vita if I land this job in Japan.)

To be quite honest, as unpopular as it would be to say this here, a big part of the reason I don't buy any of the other consoles is because I find the fan bases and the people who run the companies to be abolutely not good, and repulsively annoying. I have 0 desire to support them in any way, and refuse to subject myself to listening to their ignorance and misplaced arrogance.

I also wouldn't buy many games for the systems, but at this point that's almost less of a reason why I would buy them.

[Azure-Edge]

To be quite honest, as unpopular as it would be to say this here, a big part of the reason I don't buy any of the other consoles is because I find the fan bases and the people who run the companies to be abolutely not good, and repulsively annoying. I have 0 desire to support them in any way, and refuse to subject myself to listening to their ignorance and misplaced arrogance.

I also wouldn't buy many games for the systems, but at this point that's almost less of a reason why I would buy them.

 

To be fair I know a lot of people who own different systems and you can't judge entire fanbases based on the idiots, trolls, and fanboys on the internet. The companies themselves is debatable. I don't think Sony nor Microsoft are bad, they just have policies and do things that I don't care for. 

[grahamf]

I find that if I'm ever yearning for a nw game and none of my collection suits me, I boot into Wii Mode and check it's Virtual Console.

[GAMER1984]

Interesting post good job OP. I personally don't think the Nintendo 3rd party situation will change anytime soon. The fact is just look at the numbers 3rd party titles just aren't selling well on Wii U compared to any other system. Why is that? My personal opinion is the type of titles being made for Nintendo consoles and the audience Nintendo has. Games like Rayman legends IMO has a better chance of selling than an AC or COD. Simply put Nintendo has a more family friendly audience hate it or love it. People like to bring up certain shooters that sold decently on Wii but it had an enormous install base. 1 million games sold when you have like 70 million consoles on homes doesn't hit home to me. But when you see a game sell 5-10 million with that same install base then publishers really start turning their head basically a game like just dance. I don't care to get into what I think Nintendo can do to help turn this situation around but it will be interesting to watch how this plays out for the rest of the gen.