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Wii U's Memory Bandwidth, GPU More Powerful Than We Thought?


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#61 Ryudo

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 06:11 PM

LET'S ALL DO THE LARGE LETTERS BUT LIKE THIS ANYTIME MEGA POSTS!


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#62 grahamf

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Posted 02 March 2014 - 06:26 PM

aaand we're back to using large fonts as if it adds any validity. Looks like I have t start blocking again.


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#63 R00bot

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Posted 03 March 2014 - 12:07 AM

Guys. Stop. You're ruining this thread.


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#64 3Dude

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 02:35 AM

Guys. Stop. You're ruining this thread.


The thread was ruined the moment it was posted, it is based on 100% false misinformation, which is why idiots like megafenix are eating it up.

@megaFenix.

You have once again cluelessly confirmed what I have been telling you.

"The 360 doesnt get to use that 256Gb/s for the frame buffer the way you think it does. That bandwidth is for OPERATIONS, NOT comminications."

 

You then posted a wall of garbage you did not understand telling you EXACTLY, that the 256Gb bandwidth is EXCLUSIVELY for operations like render output processing and z testing.... And NOT for communications, which you clealry,  have yet to grasp. Also, that bandwidth meant jack crap doodly, because the CAPACITY, and COMMUNICATIONS end of the bandwidth to the edram was so poor the frame buffer couldnt be done in a single pass.... Making that 256 Gb/s figure little more than jerking in the wind, and pr for easily manipulated morons to latch onto.

 

You then moronically add all the bandwidth together as if its some stackable bonus speed multiplier, when in reality each seperate bandwidth bridge is a time sink the data has to wait at until it can move through.

Also wii u's Edram doesnt have the rops embedded with it guy. The rops have its own small pool of ram for operations.


 


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#65 GAMER1984

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 02:58 AM

The thread was ruined the moment it was posted, it is based on 100% false misinformation, which is why idiots like megafenix are eating it up.

@megaFenix.

You have once again cluelessly confirmed what I have been telling you.

"The 360 doesnt get to use that 256Gb/s for the frame buffer the way you think it does. That bandwidth is for OPERATIONS, NOT comminications."

 

You then posted a wall of garbage you did not understand telling you EXACTLY, that the 256Gb bandwidth is EXCLUSIVELY for operations like render output processing and z testing.... And NOT for communications, which you clealry,  have yet to grasp. Also, that bandwidth meant jack crap doodly, because the CAPACITY, and COMMUNICATIONS end of the bandwidth to the edram was so poor the frame buffer couldnt be done in a single pass.... Making that 256 Gb/s figure little more than jerking in the wind, and pr for easily manipulated morons to latch onto.

 

You then moronically add all the bandwidth together as if its some stackable bonus speed multiplier, when in reality each seperate bandwidth bridge is a time sink the data has to wait at until it can move through.

Also wii u's Edram doesnt have the rops embedded with it guy. The rops have its own small pool of ram for operations.


 

 

hate to be negative but can we just give up at this point... Unless the infromation is coming from a known source maybe a developer that is risking his career breaking NDA to give said information.... I say we ignore it. I mean the Wii U technical debate has gifted us with spirited conversation and debates since it was announced but we still havent gotten much anywhere... or at least concrete numbers that we want. I love the console and it has an amazing library of games that is only going to get better this year. LETS GAME!



#66 Sorceror12

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 02:58 AM

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#67 R00bot

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 03:24 AM

 

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wot


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#68 Statler

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 06:23 AM

Oh my god are you morons still on about this

 

stahp.jpg

 

Can't leave you children alone for a second without continuing a months-old argument for no reason, stop acting like this crappy argument is like debating a cure-cancer serum.

 

You're debating VIDEO GAMES. Who in the crap cares if it's more powerful or less powerful than people say? It doesn't affect you, you shouldn't care, so drop it you pansy children.


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#69 MorbidGod

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 06:51 AM

LET'S ALL DO THE LARGE LETTERS BUT LIKE THIS ANYTIME MEGA POSTS!


Who is mega?

LET'S ALL DO THE LARGE LETTERS BUT LIKE THIS ANYTIME MEGA POSTS!


do you mean megafenix?

Oh my god are you morons still on about this

stahp.jpg

Can't leave you children alone for a second without continuing a months-old argument for no reason, stop acting like this crappy argument is like debating a cure-cancer serum.

You're debating VIDEO GAMES. Who in the crap cares if it's more powerful or less powerful than people say? It doesn't affect you, you shouldn't care, so drop it you pansy children.


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#70 Ryudo

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 08:27 AM

Who is mega?


do you mean megafenix?
 

Si


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#71 Grooseland

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Posted 04 March 2014 - 08:45 AM

If Retro said it was a powerhouse... the it's a powerhouse :P



#72 Ryudo

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 10:02 AM

wot

Go watch a show called Thunderbirds. Weird as hell. Or if you ever saw team America it's based on that series well the puppets anyway.


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#73 Sorceror12

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 10:14 AM

*
POPULAR

The Wii U is a last gen console.

 

No more powerful than a PS3.

 

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#74 R00bot

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Posted 05 March 2014 - 09:21 PM

Go watch a show called Thunderbirds. Weird as hell. Or if you ever saw team America it's based on that series well the puppets anyway.

I've actually seen it, ages ago, though. I don't remember that part.


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#75 Auzzie Wingman

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 12:44 AM

My thoughts of this thread in one word....

 

 

 

 

SCROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLLL!


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#76 megafenix

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 07:47 AM

 

The thread was ruined the moment it was posted, it is based on 100% false misinformation, which is why idiots like megafenix are eating it up.

@megaFenix.

You have once again cluelessly confirmed what I have been telling you.

"The 360 doesnt get to use that 256Gb/s for the frame buffer the way you think it does. That bandwidth is for OPERATIONS, NOT comminications."

 

You then posted a wall of garbage you did not understand telling you EXACTLY, that the 256Gb bandwidth is EXCLUSIVELY for operations like render output processing and z testing.... And NOT for communications, which you clealry,  have yet to grasp. Also, that bandwidth meant jack crap doodly, because the CAPACITY, and COMMUNICATIONS end of the bandwidth to the edram was so poor the frame buffer couldnt be done in a single pass.... Making that 256 Gb/s figure little more than jerking in the wind, and pr for easily manipulated morons to latch onto.

 

You then moronically add all the bandwidth together as if its some stackable bonus speed multiplier, when in reality each seperate bandwidth bridge is a time sink the data has to wait at until it can move through.

Also wii u's Edram doesnt have the rops embedded with it guy. The rops have its own small pool of ram for operations.


 

 

and

Posted 04 March 2014 - 04:27 AM

MorbidGod, on 04 Mar 2014 - 06:51 AM, said:snapback.png

Who is mega?


do you mean megafenix?
 

Si

 

 

this forums are ruined because they have bad adminsitrators like 3dude

 

the guy wont listen and learn, he will just keep saying what he wants no matter the prves you give him, already demostrated information here that 360 indeed has 256GB/s of bandwidth reserved for framebuffer in the edram+ROPS(documents from microsoft staff, from NEC, from IGn REPORTS, from byond3d, etc). The 256GB/s are locked to the ROPS on the edram since both edram and ROPS are on the same die chip but the bandwidth is fully accesible by the logic inside the edram like the ROPS, only the rest of the gpu that is on another separate die chip has a 32GB/s limitation to the edram but that doesnt hurt cause edram was meant to be used for framebuffer by the logic inside it, gpu only recieves the already processed data from edram+logic, gpu doesnt use the edram directly for processing its stuff, thats why edram has both memory+logic to do that

 

guess the proverb is right

"old monkey doesnt learn new somersault"

 

 

seriously, whats so difficult in understanding that if 360 had 256GB/s for framebuffer on edram+rops then wiiu needs that bandwidth or more to render 720p or 1080p?

 

whats so difficult in understanding this?

http://www.ign.com/a...tation-3?page=3

 

"

E3 2005: Microsoft's Xbox 360 vs. Sony's PlayStation 3

 

by Douglass C. Perry
May 20, 2005

 

Bandwidth
The PS3 has 22.4 GB/s of GDDR3 bandwidth and 25.6 GB/s of RDRAM bandwidth for a total system bandwidth of 48 GB/s.

The Xbox 360 has 22.4 GB/s of GDDR3 bandwidth and a 256 GB/s of EDRAM bandwidth for a total of 278.4 GB/s total system bandwidth.

 

Why does the Xbox 360 have such an extreme amount of bandwidth?

Even the simplest calculations show that a large amount of bandwidth is consumed by the frame buffer. For example, with simple color rendering and Z testing at 550 MHz the frame buffer alone requires 52.8 GB/s at 8 pixels per clock. The PS3's memory bandwidth is insufficient to maintain its GPU's peak rendering speed, even without texture and vertex fetches.

The PS3 uses Z and color compression to try to compensate for the lack of memory bandwidth. The problem with Z and color compression is that the compression breaks down quickly when rendering complex next-generation 3D scenes.

 

HDR, alpha-blending, and anti-aliasing require even more memory bandwidthThis is why Xbox 360 has 256 GB/s bandwidth reserved just for the frame buffer. This allows the Xbox 360 GPU to do Z testing, HDR, and alpha blended color rendering with 4X MSAA at full rate and still have the entire main bus bandwidth of 22.4 GB/s left over for textures and vertices.

 

"

 

 

if the article above tell the truth then obviously you need lots of bandwidth for a framebuffer of 1080p and wiiu has enough for that, you need about 16MB for 1080p framebuffer on wiiu according to shinen

 

 

* whats so difficult in understanding that gamecube already had 512 bits for 1MB of edram and so 1024bits or 2048bits for a block of 4MB is no problem at all 10 years later and using 40nm and not 180nm?

 

* whats so difficult in understanding that gamecube already had almost like 20GB/s of bandwidth for just 3MB(the texture chache of 1MB had 10.56GB/s) back in 2001 and having ike 500 or terabyte of bandwidth with 32MB OF EDRAM after more than 10 years is a natural step?

 

 

* whats so difficult in understanding that if shinen can put a framebuffer of 1080p in 16MB of edram on wiiu then wiiu edram must havea lot more bandwidth than 360 for aaccomplishing that and by reading the IGN article?

 

* whats so difficult in understanding that wii u is using latest technologies of edram according to Renesas and if sony can put 1 terabyte of bandwidth with edram then so nintendo can if they just put the money?

 

 

sorry mates but you have just confirmed that you are nothing more than trolls:

its you up against facts:

* gamecube example of edram bandwidth back on 2001

* xbox 360 example using the same technology from NEC 7 years ago

* shinen comments and examples about wiiu edram edram memory and huge bandwidth enough for 1080p with just 16MB

* renesas quotes about wiiu edram using their latest technologies

* the IGN article about importance of bandwidth in framebuffer

* wiiu ports working despite are lazy and are straight ports from 360 

etc


Edited by megafenix, 06 March 2014 - 08:40 AM.


#77 3Dude

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 05:24 PM

Actually guy, the edram nec/renseas used has been identified as UX7LSeD, and at a 128 kilowords x 256 bits configuration, and a VERY clear picture of the pin count, it is nowhere near what youve been spouting. Sorry. Not really.

http://www.renesas.c...c/ipcore/edram/


I could go on explaining to you how you still dont understand the difference between memory bandwidth used for operations, and memory bandwidth used for communications, and how they dont stack, and how what you keep typing in bold and trying to repeat is so moronically brain dead stupidly obvious that its hilarious you still dont actually understand what its saying...

But I dont need to. You are officially, irrevocably, permenantly, wrong.

Goodbye.

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#78 Gruff the Villager

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 07:21 PM

 

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I thought crap like this was suppose to stop. This is SPAM. It has nothing to do with this topic and just a big distraction to the conversation.


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#79 Ryudo

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 08:33 PM

^ Get off the compuyter Grumpy Pants..get some ensure and take a long nap. You been posting grumpsidous all over the place.


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#80 Statler

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 09:53 PM

an idiot post I said never to happen

 

 

the first idiot post that should never have happened and dear god in heaven no post should be that long

 

 

Preeeeetty sure I told both of you to knock it off. 


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