18 replies to this topic

[Goodtwin]

This actually stems pretty far back to rumors that were somewhat blown off at the time, but now knowing what we know, this rumor may have been very accurate afterall. 

 

http://www.nintengen...k-gpu-info.html

 

Basically, we know that the Wii U doesnt use Direct X 11, thats a microsoft API, but it was assumed that OpenGL would be the API in its place.  Well, that code may very well run on Wii U, but may be far less efficient that Nintendo's latest API, rumored to be called GX2.  You can read up on the original GX api for gamecube and wii here:

 

http://devkitpro.org/wiki/libogc/GX

 

GX shares some similarities with OpenGL, and differs greatly in many ways as well. OpenGL, by design, masks a lot of the nitty-gritty hardware specifics, leaving implementation of it to hardware vendors, whereas the GX API is very close to the metal and many functions have little, if any, processing performed by the CPU. What this means is that, if you write smart code and know how the hardware works under the hood, you can bring out the best performance of the machine, but you'll also be working with an API that is altogether more complex than writing in a higher-level API such as OpenGL.

 

 

 

[routerbad]

This actually stems pretty far back to rumors that were somewhat blown off at the time, but now knowing what we know, this rumor may have been very accurate afterall. 

 

http://www.nintengen...k-gpu-info.html

 

Basically, we know that the Wii U doesnt use Direct X 11, thats a microsoft API, but it was assumed that OpenGL would be the API in its place.  Well, that code may very well run on Wii U, but may be far less efficient that Nintendo's latest API, rumored to be called GX2.  You can read up on the original GX api for gamecube and wii here:

 

http://devkitpro.org/wiki/libogc/GX

 

 

This actually stems pretty far back to rumors that were somewhat blown off at the time, but now knowing what we know, this rumor may have been very accurate afterall. 

 

http://www.nintengen...k-gpu-info.html

 

Basically, we know that the Wii U doesnt use Direct X 11, thats a microsoft API, but it was assumed that OpenGL would be the API in its place.  Well, that code may very well run on Wii U, but may be far less efficient that Nintendo's latest API, rumored to be called GX2.  You can read up on the original GX api for gamecube and wii here:

 

http://devkitpro.org/wiki/libogc/GX

It's been known that they would be running a modified OpenGL, consoles don't typically run the official release API, and develop their own that suits their platform.  GX2 just seems like it would be another modified form of OpenGL.

[3Dude]

Its whats been rumoured for a long time. Makes sense since wii and gc used GX(1)

[Goodtwin]

I guess I just hadnt heard much about it before, so it struck my interest. 

 

When they talked about "features" that accessible and dont impact performance.  Basically, there are use them or less them features.  There are potentially a lot of features there within the hardware that dont translate to decreased performance when in use, but also dont increase performance when sitting idle.  I just have a feeling that just like the GC/Wii, there are features there that can make an incredible difference, but its up to the developer to make use of them (and know of them and how to implement them, that parts on Nintendo).  For example, there could be features there there that a developer could use to free up the SPU's, but if developers are unaware of them, and are simply having the SPU's do the work just like on other consoles, this could be a huge drag on how the hardware was really designed to be used.   

Edited by Goodtwin, 18 April 2013 - 11:38 AM.

[routerbad]

I guess I just hadnt heard much about it before, so it struck my interest. 

The description of the API also makes sense.  Sticking strictly with OpenGL would have made coding for the machine easier, but less flexible.  Giving access to the bare metal allows programmers to get more out of the system, though it takes a lot longer to get a handle on all of the features available.

[Goodtwin]

Yea, it sounds like the features of there, but there is some work involved in making use of those featuers.  Kind of like the TEV in the GC/Wii, it was a use it or lose it feature.  Developers didnt get extra performance in other areas by not using the TEV, and at the same time when they did use the TEV, it didnt drag down performance.  One of the features listed was a tessellation unit, can you imagine the amount of performance that could be freed up if the Wii U has an effiicient tessellation unit built in. 

[Plutonas]

I think nintendo uses their own API AND ALSO OPEN GL..

 

 

sony uses ONLY OPEN GL.

[Foot]

For once, i actually don't know what this means in terms of specs...

[Usman Mohammad]

I think nintendo uses their own API AND ALSO OPEN GL..

 

 

sony uses ONLY OPEN GL.

Both Sony and Nintendo use a customised API that is based on OpenGL. Wii U uses GX2 and PlayStation API is PSGL

[Goodtwin]

For once, i actually don't know what this means in terms of specs...

 

Its just Nintendo's own API, kind of like Microsoft has DirectX. 

 

On the subject of tessellation, ATI had it as a hardware feature for years and with the HD4000 series cards they had it working at a high level, but because it was a hardware specific feature of their cards, not many developers really supported it.  Now that tessellation is a programable feature with DX11, its going to see a lot more support.  With Wii U, its going to be done the old schooll ATI way, with a tesselator. 

[SoldMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

BREAKING NEWS: The Wii U uses chipsets, wires, circuit boards, plastic and cooling fans............................................

[Goodtwin]

BREAKING NEWS: The Wii U uses chipsets, wires, circuit boards, plastic and cooling fans............................................

 

Breaking news, you just wasted your time making a not good post when you could have easily ignored the topic if you werent interested in the discussion.  Good job.

[routerbad]

BREAKING NEWS: The Wii U uses chipsets, wires, circuit boards, plastic and cooling fans............................................

Pffft...Shows what you know, there is obviously a mouse turning a wheel reaching for cheese in there.  What do you think a hardware tessellator is?

Edited by routerbad, 18 April 2013 - 12:45 PM.

[Robotic Sunshine Commander]

Honestly, I think there should be two separate sections on the main page for " accessories" and "hardware" as the two seem to get mixed up a lot here.

[3Dude]

Goodtwin, on 18 Apr 2013 - 06:28 AM, said:Its just Nintendo's own API, kind of like Microsoft has DirectX. 
On the subject of tessellation, ATI had it as a hardware feature for years and with the HD4000 series cards they had it working at a high level, but because it was a hardware specific feature of their cards, not many developers really supported it.  Now that tessellation is a programable feature with DX11, its going to see a lot more support.  With Wii U, its going to be done the old schooll ATI way, with a tesselator. 


Yeah, this will also be the fourth nintendo console to feature a tesselator unit.... (cube, wii, 3ds wii u) So, they are actually quite experienced with tesselation, to the point they actually have used it as the foundation of a games main gameplay/interaction mechanic (skyward sword) instead of just decoration.

To date the only system i dont know of using its tesselation capabilities is 3ds.

cube: Windwaker (water/boat interaction animation)

wii:

Wii sports (wii tennis targets, used to create assets in real time depending on where ball hits)

Excite truck: Used for terrain morphs, also used in conjunction with physics engine for real time accurate to area hit, object hit, speed hit at, and direction hit vehicle damage. ie, if you run into a tree, a dent precisely the size and shape of that tree trunk will form, animated in real time, the severity of which depending on the speed of the impact, and then, if sat a coconut falls from said tree and lands on car, a coconut sized and shaped dent will form where it hits. Very amusing to watch the crash system in action during replays.

Wii sports resort. Its what nintendo uses to slice stuff up with a sword. Tesselation is used to create new assets dependant upon user input.

skyward sword: Same use as in sports resort. Also used for the sand pile blowing mechanic (not the little ones that blow away, but the interactive ones).


Cant wait to see what they do with this much power, when theyve already done so much with so little.

[Alex Atkin UK]

And here I was thinking all a tesselator did was making rudimentary models look smoother by generating more polygons in real-time.  I had no idea it was so flexible.

[SoldMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

I was joking guys, aww c'mon...................

[Alex Atkin UK]

Well you had to be, as the Wii U DOESN'T use cooling fans, it uses A cooling fan.

[Mewbot]

Well you had to be, as the Wii U DOESN'T use cooling fans, it uses A cooling fan.

The fan in the wii u is great! It stays pretty much completely silent no matter what you're doing.

 

I was joking guys, aww c'mon...................

It's cool, I thought you were joking. Well, I say thought, I mean hoped.