62 replies to this topic

[routerbad]

A mum bought her son a gun? 

That's America's gun laws in a nutshell.

No it isn't.  You can't legally own a firearm until the age of 18, in any state in the union.  21 for anything with a pistol grip.  This cockamamy misrepresentation of American gun law is actually starting to rile me up.

 

Not only that, but there is a reason the games are rated mature, and how many parents pay fuc**ng attention to the label when they buy their kid a game just to shut them up about it.  Just to clarify for anyone that does not know, violent video games CAN and WILL desensitize young people to violent images, with enough exposure to the point that there is a dopamine surge when they view violent images.  For anyone that doesn't understand that, you can become addicted to violent images because the pleasure centers of your brain light up after long periods of exposure.

 

This is why we try to shield young, developing, immature, malleable children away from these types of themes, they aren't ready to handle it in the doses they're being exposed to.

[cannonshane]

Sounds like most little rage filled kids that lose at cod.

No it isn't. You can't legally own a firearm until the age of 18, in any state in the union. 21 for anything with a pistol grip. This cockamamy misrepresentation of American gun law is actually starting to rile me up.

Not only that, but there is a reason the games are rated mature, and how many parents pay fuc**ng attention to the label when they buy their kid a game just to shut them up about it. Just to clarify for anyone that does not know, violent video games CAN and WILL desensitize young people to violent images, with enough exposure to the point that there is a dopamine surge when they view violent images. For anyone that doesn't understand that, you can become addicted to violent images because the pleasure centers of your brain light up after long periods of exposure.

This is why we try to shield young, developing, immature, malleable children away from these types of themes, they aren't ready to handle it in the doses they're being exposed to.

Not that I would allow my children to but my parents didn't no much about video games when I was younger and I was allowed to play whatever, hell manhunt was one of my favourites as a young fella, I don't believe it's just video games I believe they have the potential to trigger underlying issues, but they are not the actual cause of such acts as this one.

Edited by cannonshane, 05 May 2013 - 07:09 PM.

[Auzzie Wingman]

Julio

You are not allowed to post Zinix topics on these forums. Reported.

[grahamf]

It's kind of hard to NOT blame video games, specifically Call Of Duty. It's online player mode has a lot of verbal abuse, which might influence 13 year olds. They're too young to NOT be.

I would never give my kids such a game (if I had kids), and I would make it clear that I do not want them playing games like that when at their friends house.

[Zinix]

Julio

You are not allowed to post Zinix topics on these forums. Reported.

I don't even post these kind of threads anymore ;/ 

[dante👌]

It's kind of hard to NOT blame video games, specifically Call Of Duty. It's online player mode has a lot of verbal abuse, which might influence 13 year olds. They're too young to NOT be.

I would never give my kids such a game (if I had kids), and I would make it clear that I do not want them playing games like that when at their friends house.

What's kinda funny about this, I am 14 as of now, but i played a lot of cod when i was 11/12, and it has no affect on me, I deal with guns, I can clean them, shoot them, fix them etc. (depends on the gun lol), but it all depends on who raised you, if you didn't have a parent to tell you "Don't do this or that when you are older, that is a bad thing" and do it more often then it can have more of an affect on them.

[Nomad]

This story... Everything about it is freaking messed up and crazy.

[Xiombarg]

I'm really not sure what to say about this.  I'm already against the idea of giving a kid a gun just because of some gun mentality.  I mean it's fine if adults have them (if they have taken basic gun training or safety classes), hell, even I (who doesn't like or own any guns in the first place) know more about safety than about half the people at my school.

 

What's kinda funny about this, I am 14 as of now, but i played a lot of cod when i was 11/12, and it has no affect on me, I deal with guns, I can clean them, shoot them, fix them etc. (depends on the gun lol), but it all depends on who raised you, if you didn't have a parent to tell you "Don't do this or that when you are older, that is a bad thing" and do it more often then it can have more of an affect on them.

It's not that it had no effect on you, but it had a different or less intense effect.  It really depends on the individual and if they are more predisposed to violence due to factors such as their current mental state, their friends, their family, if they have any mental issues (like a disorder), if they have already been desensitized, and so on.  Some people also cannot distinguish reality from fiction at times.

[Hunter]

Why do people own guns in the first place? I don't get it. The only reason you would own a gun is if you enjoy violence so it's no wonder people go around shooting each other all time.

[grahamf]

oop here we go.

 

I'm sick of the flamewar that alway follow sentences like that: so I'm going to be blunt:

 

Switzerland has the third highest gun ownership levels (USA is first) and that's due to the government's policy of mandatory enlistment of nearly ALL citizens, after which they are given a rifle. But they are all trained to handle them, and gun safety is a very high priority in their training.

 

I believe in the USA the gun mentality and Second Amendment are holdovers to when the States were fighting to be independent of Britain and the civil war. Since then the country is continually in preparation of a cold war or civil war, with faith that all they need is guns out the wazoo to protect themselves instead of something minor like sound government.

[Dragon]

Why do people own guns in the first place? I don't get it. The only reason you would own a gun is if you enjoy violence so it's no wonder people go around shooting each other all time.

 

I'm around guns. I've shot them. I've been taught gun safety. I'll even be getting my gun permit when I get to the age of requirement. So does that mean I enjoy violence? Haha NO. I hate violence. I'm scared of conflict. The only reasons I want guns are for a hobby and self-defense. To assume people want guns just because they enjoy violence is pure ignorance.

 

The problem has been the mentally unstable people behind the weapon.

 

https://en.wikipedia...ma_City_bombing

^

168/169 Deaths with over 600 injuries. All without a single bullet.

 

Sure, guns are more easily accessible, but with the right crafting and good wits, you could do a LOT more damage with properly crafted bombs.

 

Ignoring everything; Even with a gun ban in place, America would still too many. There would be a HUGE black market for them.

[Byakuya Togami]

I could of sworn I posted here.
 
Anyway, this is really unfortunate.  Obviously he wasn't in the "right" state of mind, he probably has psychological issues that never were addressed. The media of course will blame violent video games like always, instead of actually looking further into this. Truly an egregious act, I  would need dream of harming my mother, let alone another living thing.

This.

The media will of course jump on this, to try and cram their dogmatic, hypocritical morals down our throats. The kid obviously has mental problems and they weren't dealt with. If he were to snap because he missed church, would people then begin to blame the pope?

[Hunter]

I'm around guns. I've shot them. I've been taught gun safety. I'll even be getting my gun permit when I get to the age of requirement. So does that mean I enjoy violence? Haha NO. I hate violence. I'm scared of conflict. The only reasons I want guns are for a hobby and self-defense. To assume people want guns just because they enjoy violence is pure ignorance.

 

The problem has been the mentally unstable people behind the weapon.

 

https://en.wikipedia...ma_City_bombing

^

168/169 Deaths with over 600 injuries. All without a single bullet.

 

Sure, guns are more easily accessible, but with the right crafting and good wits, you could do a LOT more damage with properly crafted bombs.

 

Ignoring everything; Even with a gun ban in place, America would still too many. There would be a HUGE black market for them.

 

"Self defence" is the usual explanation behind owning a gun, but what does the actually mean? Defence from who? My brother lives in an area where there have been several stabbings, yet he doesn't carry a knife around or have a knife ready in his house to defend himself. As for a "hobby" enjoying shooting things is basically an enjoyment of violence, sure shooting targets isn't going to hurt anyone, but the whole point of shooting targets is to improve your shooting skills so you will be able to shoot that guy who breaks into your house to steal your TV.

 

There really is no need to own a gun. That's the way I see it anyway.

 

We're not really talking about terrorism here. Obviously bombs could do a lot more damage but it is difficult to control home made bombs and much easier to control guns.

 

There are 40 times more intentional homicides committed with a firearm in the US than the UK. The US has an intentional homicide rate of 4.8, compared to the UK's 1.2.

 

No, banning guns would never work, but it's clear something has to be done.

[dante👌]

"Self defence" is the usual explanation behind owning a gun, but what does the actually mean? Defence from who? My brother lives in an area where there have been several stabbings, yet he doesn't carry a knife around or have a knife ready in his house to defend himself. As for a "hobby" enjoying shooting things is basically an enjoyment of violence, sure shooting targets isn't going to hurt anyone, but the whole point of shooting targets is to improve your shooting skills so you will be able to shoot that guy who breaks into your house to steal your TV.

 

There really is no need to own a gun. That's the way I see it anyway.

 

We're not really talking about terrorism here. Obviously bombs could do a lot more damage but it is difficult to control home made bombs and much easier to control guns.

 

There are 40 times more intentional homicides committed with a firearm in the US than the UK. The US has an intentional homicide rate of 4.8, compared to the UK's 1.2.

 

No, banning guns would never work, but it's clear something has to be done.

I have a couple reasons for owning a gun, Of course self defense, And you don't understand the point behind self defense? what if you're home and someone breaks into your house, And has you at gunpoint? Like a story i saw once, a family of 4 had 2 robbers break in, 1 stay outside and the other had them at gunpoint, The robber told the wife to go and get the money out of the safe, So she walks back there, Grabs the money, and her husbands 6-shooter, Keeps the gun behind her back and then hands the robber the money, she puts the gun on her husbands back, he grabs it, and unloads 4 rounds into the robber, Then they were safe, Now they could have been shot and killed without that gun, But they weren't, everyone has their reasons, And how dare you say that Having guns as a hobby is saying we enjoy violence? That is absurd, I do not enjoy violence, I just like shooting targets, Cleaning them etc, and you say "No, banning guns would never work, but it's clear something has to be done." What has to be done? 

 

[routerbad]

Sounds like most little rage filled kids that lose at cod.

Not that I would allow my children to but my parents didn't no much about video games when I was younger and I was allowed to play whatever, hell manhunt was one of my favourites as a young fella, I don't believe it's just video games I believe they have the potential to trigger underlying issues, but they are not the actual cause of such acts as this one.

Agreed, but many personality disorders aren't apparent until much later in life, and most are not allowed to be diagnosed until after 21.  Until that point they are still skulls full of mush and can be conditioned to many things, and being desensitized to violent images is very dangerous and suggestive, and for teenagers that are struggling to answer existential questions of self identity and at the same time struggling for acceptance and dealing with raging hormones it isn't appropriate.  There is a reason we have the ESRB, to give parents insight into what is in a game.

[Hunter]

I have a couple reasons for owning a gun, Of course self defense, And you don't understand the point behind self defense? what if you're home and someone breaks into your house, And has you at gunpoint? Like a story i saw once, a family of 4 had 2 robbers break in, 1 stay outside and the other had them at gunpoint, The robber told the wife to go and get the money out of the safe, So she walks back there, Grabs the money, and her husbands 6-shooter, Keeps the gun behind her back and then hands the robber the money, she puts the gun on her husbands back, he grabs it, and unloads 4 rounds into the robber, Then they were safe, Now they could have been shot and killed without that gun, But they weren't, everyone has their reasons, And how dare you say that Having guns as a hobby is saying we enjoy violence? That is absurd, I do not enjoy violence, I just like shooting targets, Cleaning them etc, and you say "No, banning guns would never work, but it's clear something has to be done." What has to be done? 

 

"what if" someone released gas into a shopping mall? Does that mean I should wear a gas mask at all times?

 

"what if" someone started firing on people in a shopping mall? Does that mean I should wear a bulletproof vest at all times?

 

There are a lot of "what ifs" in life and if you tried to "defend" yourself against them all then you wouldn't be able to live a real life.

 

And the enjoyment of shooting can suggest an enjoyment of violence, even if it is on a subconscious level.

 

Something has to be done = tighter gun control laws

[dante👌]

"what if" someone released gas into a shopping mall? Does that mean I should wear a gas mask at all times?

 

"what if" someone started firing on people in a shopping mall? Does that mean I should wear a bulletproof vest at all times?

 

There are a lot of "what ifs" in life and if you tried to "defend" yourself against them all then you wouldn't be able to live a real life.

 

And the enjoyment of shooting can suggest an enjoyment of violence, even if it is on a subconscious level.

 

Something has to be done = tighter gun control laws

I'm telling you i do not enjoy violence at all, Opinions are opinions, you can keep thinking that but it doesn't  happen to everyone, and even if they do tighter gun control laws, It's not going to do anything.

[cannonshane]

Agreed, but many personality disorders aren't apparent until much later in life, and most are not allowed to be diagnosed until after 21. Until that point they are still skulls full of mush and can be conditioned to many things, and being desensitized to violent images is very dangerous and suggestive, and for teenagers that are struggling to answer existential questions of self identity and at the same time struggling for acceptance and dealing with raging hormones it isn't appropriate. There is a reason we have the ESRB, to give parents insight into what is in a game.

True but how many parents actually use it as a guide, most don't care. And i dont buy into all that teenagers have hormones raging and don't no what to do blah blah. I was a teenager not so long ago, and the last thing I would have thought about would have been raping then killing my own mother. This kid obviously had major issues long before he played cod etc.

Edited by cannonshane, 06 May 2013 - 11:52 AM.

[routerbad]

"what if" someone released gas into a shopping mall? Does that mean I should wear a gas mask at all times?

 

"what if" someone started firing on people in a shopping mall? Does that mean I should wear a bulletproof vest at all times?

 

There are a lot of "what ifs" in life and if you tried to "defend" yourself against them all then you wouldn't be able to live a real life.

 

And the enjoyment of shooting can suggest an enjoyment of violence, even if it is on a subconscious level.

 

Something has to be done = tighter gun control laws

What the hell are you on about?  Of course things happen that we are unprepared for, that doesn't mean that everything is hunky dory and that parents shouldn't be mindful of the types of interactive experiences they allow their kids to partake.

 

That doesn't mean that parents should just give up on parenting now because well, anything can happen at any time, so it really isn't worth putting in the effort.

 

That doesn't have anything to do with governments disarming citizens for no other reason than to have more control over the populace.  Disarming doesn't prevent would be criminals from possessing weapons, it just makes everyone else an easier target for them.

 

The enjoyment of shooting doesn't make a person enjoy violent images any more.  I thoroughly enjoy shooting now and for the 9 years I spent in the Marine Corps, but even that does not make me enjoy witnessing wanton violence.

 

You seem to have missed my point completely.

 

Children are extremely vulnerably to suggestion.  Up until a person has reached full physical and mental maturation they are still extremely vulnerable to suggestive material(ever wonder why people above the age of 25ish are said to be "stuck in their ways?).

 

It is every parent's responsibility to give their children an environment where they can explore difficult topics in a safe way, without glorification, so they can be prepared to make decisions when the time comes that they are required to do so.

 

Again there is a reason there are ratings on any form of media, it is similar to having a gas mask at the ready when you go to the mall.  It can be used by parents to make decisions on what they will allow their children to consume, but it doesn't do enough to really educate parents on what they risks really are.

 

Now, violence is not to blame for something like this.  The environment the child grew up in, one where Call of Duty was used as a reward/punishment system is to blame for this.  An environment that glorified the violent images in a game by making them a reward for good behavior, putting the full force of the child's pleasure center at work.

[Hunter]

What the hell are you on about?  Of course things happen that we are unprepared for, that doesn't mean that everything is hunky dory and that parents shouldn't be mindful of the types of interactive experiences they allow their kids to partake.

 

That doesn't mean that parents should just give up on parenting now because well, anything can happen at any time, so it really isn't worth putting in the effort.

 

That doesn't have anything to do with governments disarming citizens for no other reason than to have more control over the populace.  Disarming doesn't prevent would be criminals from possessing weapons, it just makes everyone else an easier target for them.

 

The enjoyment of shooting doesn't make a person enjoy violent images any more.  I thoroughly enjoy shooting now and for the 9 years I spent in the Marine Corps, but even that does not make me enjoy witnessing wanton violence.

 

You seem to have missed my point completely.

 

Children are extremely vulnerably to suggestion.  Up until a person has reached full physical and mental maturation they are still extremely vulnerable to suggestive material(ever wonder why people above the age of 25ish are said to be "stuck in their ways?).

 

It is every parent's responsibility to give their children an environment where they can explore difficult topics in a safe way, without glorification, so they can be prepared to make decisions when the time comes that they are required to do so.

 

Again there is a reason there are ratings on any form of media, it is similar to having a gas mask at the ready when you go to the mall.  It can be used by parents to make decisions on what they will allow their children to consume, but it doesn't do enough to really educate parents on what they risks really are.

 

Now, violence is not to blame for something like this.  The environment the child grew up in, one where Call of Duty was used as a reward/punishment system is to blame for this.  An environment that glorified the violent images in a game by making them a reward for good behavior, putting the full force of the child's pleasure center at work.

 

Wait. What? I wasn't talking about parenting. I was talking about the point of owning a gun.

 

Anyway, I don't think I'm going to listen to the views of gun control from someone who was in the armed forces. Obviously you are going to be pro-guns.