109 replies to this topic

[Nintendoes]

It doesn't need to be ultra powerful to be the most powerful. It's unlikely they're going to make an absolute powerhouse of a console, but will it be stronger than Wii U and 720? Probably. Sony will be last to launch again and they are going to take advantage of that by having hardware that's more powerful than competitors, even if only by a small amount. It's hard not to sell consoles at a loss these days, with how powerful the hardware is and with all the multimedia functions that they end up having. The 3DS is being sold at a loss, and the Wii U will be too, so Sony won't exactly be massively behind by selling Vita and PS4 at a loss too.

It is being sold at a loss?

[Deadly Virus]

It is being sold at a loss?

It's inevitable, one of the factors that hurt the 3DS's launch was that people believed it to be overpriced, Nintendo doesn't want to repeat that. Plus like I said, a powerful console NEEDS to be sold at a loss or else it'll end up like the PS3 in it's first few years.

[Lain]

The PS3 is far from being a "success." It was a huge disaster that only recently managed to get back up on its feet.

And while the 3DS tanked at first, I believe most of the blame goes to the lack of system-selling first party games like Mario Kart. I mean, even after the price drop, hardware sales were still only modest until 'round November when Super Mario 3D Land came out. Though $250 was too high, I won't dispute that.

[Shokio]

The Vita hasn't come out yet, so you can't say it has lost if the battle hasn't even started.

But yeah, I don't believe there will be a drastic difference, if only because there will be no developmental support for it.

I doesn't take rocket science to know the Vita will lose. Yes, it's only came out in Japan, but the thing is, I'm comparing the JAPAN sales. The PSP did better than the Vita did, a lot better, while the 3DS actually did better than the DS. There's many factors as to why the Vita will lose, and it's pretty obvious:

1) The 3DS has Monster Hunter 4 (This was a HUGE loss for Sony, as MH accounted for most of the PSP's sales in the first place)
2) Thanks to the DS, the 3DS has a larger install base
3) Nintendo franchises have more mass market appeal than than Sony's (Pokemon, Mario)
4) The 3DS is cheaper
5) Vita games cost more, not to mention the expensive memory cards. The 3DS is much more appealing price-wise.
6) The 3DS has an over 10 million headstart.
7) It's a Nintendo handheld.

This is all really just common sense.

Edited by Shokio, 28 January 2012 - 03:00 PM.

[Crackkat]

I doesn't take rocket science to know the Vita will lose. Yes, it's only came out in Japan, but the thing is, I'm comparing the JAPAN sales. The PSP did better than the Vita did, a lot better, while the 3DS actually did better than the DS. There's many factors as to why the Vita will lose, and it's pretty obvious:

1) The 3DS has Monster Hunter 4 (This was a HUGE loss for Sony, as MH accounted for most of the PSP's sales in the first place)
2) Thanks to the DS, the 3DS has a larger install base
3) Nintendo franchises have more mass market appeal than than Sony's (Pokemon, Mario)
4) The 3DS is cheaper
5) Vita games cost more, not to mention the expensive memory cards. The 3DS is much more appealing price-wise.

This is all really just common sense.

not to mention the 3D capability

[Lain]

The Xbox 360 is practically non-existant in Japan, yet it's still alive and kicking. Give the Vita a chance in West before we proclaim death to the system. It's current software library does tend to Western gaming needs moreso than the 3DS, so there is a possibility of it doing well there.

That said, I don't expect it to beat the 3DS at all.

[Shokio]

"Give the Vita a chance in West before we proclaim death to the system."

I never said it was DOA. I'm not a fanboy, I hope that the Vita would do well and I would never wish for any company to leave the industry. I just said it WON'T beat the 3DS. That's pretty much a given.

"That said, I don't expect it to beat the 3DS at all."

Exactly what I was saying.

Edited by Shokio, 28 January 2012 - 03:03 PM.

[Tre]

you do realize that before the wii Nintendo always had at least the second most powerful console and even when they were second they were pretty damn close so it wouldnt be surprising if sony released another powerful console considering theyll probably be last to release next generation again.

That's true but with the Wii U in 2012, and the nextbox in 2013 it will have technology from.... a set amount of years behind that.
Now add 3 years of better technology, PS4 will likely be quite a bit stronger mainly due to its late launch. (However if the Wii U and Nextbox beat the ps3 into the ground it could come a lot sooner changing things up a bit)

To the both of you, My point was simply it doesn't matter. When one console is left on an island by itself it doesn't receive enough support or the support that majority gamers want. Nintendo can survive off of First Party titles alone. Microsoft and Sony cannot. They need third party. They know it. So if the PS4 is some juggernaut then who is gonna support it when developers will be able to create games for the Wii U and the next Xbox easily. The game would have to be made from the ground up and it would actually be the reverse situation of the Wii. PS4 would need to be within the range (greater it can be) but not too much due to the third party support.

Edited by Tre, 29 January 2012 - 03:32 PM.

[Auzzie Wingman]

Speculating on consoles that don't exist is funny.

In order for the Playstation 4 for to be a lot more powerful than the Wii U and the Nextbox, it's going to need some serious firepower.

Of course, firepower needs money... money that the Stool doesn't have.

They are going to be inevitably behind the competition, possibly by a 2 year period, at which point, if they don't have a good, new technology that makes it wow-worthy, it's going to suffer. If it feels like just a beefed up Nextbox or Wii U, it's not going to sell at the ridiculous price it will be at launch.

Essentially, Sony can't afford to sell another PS3, cost wise. They have three things they need to do, and it's going to be really hard for them (I just think it would be better for Sony not to bother)

- Technology that separates it from the other two... (Oh damn, I'm having one of them Internet Deja Vu moments again)
- Affordable, and considering the way the world is turning right now, that's going to be a struggle.
- Mitigated losses in sale. If they sell at a loss, it needs to be damn tight.

... As much as I'd liked to say that the PS4 is 100% screwed, it's still an imaginary console, so that opinion is invalid.

[Lain]

(I just think it would be better for Sony not to bother)

I had this very thought, but it was for the Vita. Why Sony even bothered with Vita is beyond me. They haven't done anything about their PSP, so making another handheld just seemed dumb. They've already entered the scene though, so there's no turning back. The PS4 needs to happen though - Their console line-up is their most important one, so what they decide to do with it is crucial.

By your first point, I'd like you to elaborate on that. The PS3 was meant to be completely different from the competition, with CELL and Blu-Ray, and a couple of other features, yet that didn't really help them. Ultimately, it just turned into an Xbox 360 clone with a few different exclusives. What's most important when designing the PS4 is preventing it from being anything like the PS3.

Something you completely missed, however, is third party exclusives. The Playstation and Playstation 2 not only had great libraries, but they had way more than a handful of third party exclusives. Things like Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Tekken, Devil May Cry etc. were all at one point only available on Sony's platform, and that advantage made Sony's platform the best platform. This is no longer the case, and multiplatting games is a pretty popular trend these days. Sony should use whatever reserves they've got to secure exclusives and build strong partnerships with third parties.