48 replies to this topic

[Nollog]

PC on ultra 1080p


PS3 and XBOX 360 runs at worse than low and 720p instead of 1080p, so it's like a little bit worse than this


PC looks a lot better in my opinion. As I said before both of these pictures is pc and xbox and ps3 looks worse than that.

How are Apple products going for you?

I said the graphics are generated the same way.
They are.

[Hinkik]

How are Apple products going for you?

I said the graphics are generated the same way.
They are.

I don't care for apple products, just the mac pros and iphones. But I'm not a millionaire so I can't afford them. Why are you asking?

Yes indeed they are generated the same way but I'm talking about that the PC on Ultra looks better than consoles. Every polygonal 3d game's graphics are generated the same way btw. But the more powerful/optimized the console/pc is the more effects, passes, polygons and stuff like that can you add into it.

Tell me one PC exclusive game that looks good btw just for fun cause I don't know any.

[Keviin]

Is it sad I can't tell the difference in these two pictures other than the first one has better shadowing (by alot),AA, and better dust effects and a bit better quality dirt texture on the guys wrist.

I don't notice much difference either (but my phone is no more than 320p I believe)

[Plutonas]

apple products lots its meaning, since they turn to PC technology... ONLY the OS is good... the hardware is just a cheap materials of pc technology and you can also built A MUCH superior system and add the leopard in.. (hackidosh).. Its not hard..

I would never buy an apple product... cheap materials and cheap customer service..

[Stewox]

Can the wii u create graphic that are similar to that of a pc?

Yes the hardware is modern ~2009 level technology, instead of ~1999-2001 that was in the Wii

Edited by Stewox, 26 May 2012 - 05:16 AM.

[Nollog]

I don't care for apple products, just the mac pros and iphones. But I'm not a millionaire so I can't afford them. Why are you asking?

Yes indeed they are generated the same way but I'm talking about that the PC on Ultra looks better than consoles. Every polygonal 3d game's graphics are generated the same way btw. But the more powerful/optimized the console/pc is the more effects, passes, polygons and stuff like that can you add into it.

Tell me one PC exclusive game that looks good btw just for fun cause I don't know any.

Then why'd you quote me?
PC and Consoles generate graphics in the same way.

There are no PC exclusives anymore.
And comparing an indie development to a AAAAAA Microsoft effort, would be silly.

[neverwinteru]

There are no PC exclusives anymore.
And comparing an indie development to a AAAAAA Microsoft effort, would be silly.

i know im sort of jumping back into the conversation now but their are plenty of pc exclusive games that have not come to the console's.

[Nollog]

i know im sort of jumping back into the conversation now but their are plenty of pc exclusive games that have not come to the console's.

Games of visual parity with those of Halo23, Uncharted, or Batman Arkham * ?

[neverwinteru]

Games of visual parity with those of Halo23, Uncharted, or Batman Arkham * ?

Arma 3, the witcher 2 before it came to xbox 360, diablo3( though i guess it could be hard to compare it since the camera is so far)

[Nollog]

Arma 3, the witcher 2 before it came to xbox 360, diablo3( though i guess it could be hard to compare it since the camera is so far)

Do you need to look-up what Exclusive means?
I'll wait here.

[neverwinteru]

Do you need to look-up what Exclusive means?
I'll wait here.

the only game i listed that isn't an exclusive is witcher 2, which was still an exclusive at some point

[Nollog]

arma3 is not out yet.
diablo 3 isn't pushing anything, but it still looks better than skyrim on console.
But they're different view-points so hard to compare 1:1

http://img26.imagesh.../comapreeee.jpg

http://diablo3.gamon... Summoners2.jpg

[neverwinteru]

but arma 3 does have screenshot's which should give you an idea of how great it will look when its out.

that was my point though im sure if their was a first person mod for diablo 3 it would look just as good as Skyrim.

BTW i don't know if you meant to include halo 2 in your list but that defiantly wasn't an Xbox exclusive.

[Nollog]

that was my point though im sure if their was a first person mod for diablo 3 it would look just as good as Skyrim.

My point was a PC exclusive game will look much better than a game which comes out on a console.
So Skyrim 360 looks worse than diablo 3.
Look at the arch in the diablo image and then look at whatever you want to in the skyrim 360 one, which looks "better"?
There'd be better examples if there were PC exclusives of genres with AA games on consoles.

BTW i don't know if you meant to include halo 2 in your list but that defiantly wasn't an Xbox exclusive.

23*
Those games I listed are console games.

Edited by Nollog, 26 May 2012 - 04:34 PM.

[neverwinteru]

My point was a PC exclusive game will look much better than a game which comes out on a console.
So Skyrim 360 looks worse than diablo 3.
Look at the arch in the diablo image and then look at whatever you want to in the skyrim 360 one, which looks "better"?
There'd be better examples if there were PC exclusives of genres with AA games on consoles.


23*
Those games I listed are console games.

o then i guess i misinterpreted your point i agree that pc exclusives always look better than console games

[Stewox]

it might be able to compete with PC graphics for a while but the PC exclusives and future PC games will be able to beat the graphics of the Wii u.

It wont compete in the get go with anything on the PC that is truly in the height of it' standard. Consoles aren't the tech shaking forefront they used to be, and as nintendo isn't focusing on the tech it's pretty doubtful tere would be an early edge .. it just isnt possible.

However on the software side .. which is way more behind ... is an open question, graphics isnt just tech, it's effort put into making it, blizzard games are PC exclusives and they never had groundbreaking graphics nor engine tech yet they dominate the market and keep breaking their own records, tech companies like epic and crytek are not going crazy competing with engine licensing and tools war while not providing the best game quality ... there are some exceptions in industry ofcourse its those games that srt the standard ... crysis could have been a lot better if crytek supported it but no crytek made consolized crysis 2 a piece of carp version of the franchise ... it's not about crysis 2 being on consoles as the sole cause for being bad... its a precise combination and design that makes it bad, a design fault, you cannot make a good game that is as good on a multiplatform level by bringing it from one platform and compromising the design to make it technically work with the lowest denominator while following suit on another example of commercial success, crysis 2 ended up this diabolical mix cut up job of trying to make a design that was made for PCs with a mainstream mix of your standard console shooter that was it self already a terrible derivative, the modern warfail. not only was crysis 2 a fundamental flaw in design, it was also annoying because of the everyday cliches picked up by following suits.

Its not the console games that are bad its the wastern approach and design philosophy, its too commercial, poor design choices .... and most terrible console games are obviously the PC ports ... thats the whole point and cause... PC developers arent good on consoles ... it wasnt a design choice to develop for another platform it was a business one , psychologically and technially flawed, it was all a profit opportunity "ah look tons of sales ... we'll just modify what we have and bring it there ...done" ... the fact why this works is because stupid* people will buy it, simple as that, and you can fill that "stupid" term with all kinds of possibilities of inexperience and combinations, as well as genuine progressin, everyone was a beginner, the problem comes when people are stuck and dont make any progress in improving, large companies work hard to keeep a lot of people stuck, they know they are making profit off exploiting your ignorance. Its not their business to make you hardcore and skilled, they dont possibly see a sustainable business model there, strong communities make you better becsuse its a good cause to grow it in the better direction, gamers do and only a little of those companies still exist where actual gamers and developers who were there and worked their ass off to stay afloat in those early years, are the bosses today.

Obviously the examples are many but still to the ratio of everyone, slim, the two companies that I will explain in this example are Blizzard and Nintendo, they actually know what they're doing, they're the original talent, they run their business not somebody telling them what to do, they've struck the best balance in a game, it's not a 50/50, it's way more complex, and graphics are least important, gameplay is always firts and foremost.

The philosophy of these companies is important, they don't make the fundamental mistakes, and that one is, bringing SOFTWARE onto the HARDWARE that it was not originally designed for. Nintendo will not make games for apple, apple's devices are for casual stupid people who can't deal with any buttons let alone game controllers(eg.: pachter's wife).
Blizzard will not port existing franchises that were designed for PC hardware and it's original accessories for different platforms. Gameplay that makes sense and is feasible without compromises might be ported over, like diablo 3, but they're experimenting still.

Nintenod has a lot of experimenting, most companies don't take the research of software as seriously, they don't have idea pretty much, this is a pretty complex and most diluted industry on the planet, that's because possibilites are opened because of the internet, while good, internet has contributed negatively to the psychological and mental side, only a few companies are making this ship afloat, it's not PC gaming that is dying, it's the quality and talent, all this tablet and smartphone carp is very unhealth and destructive, it's not the proper way to recruit begginer, it SPOILS THEM and they're forever stupid and nooby and paranoid about touching a controller, doing this from an early age is very dangerous, kids could be born assholes, because of companies doing everything for them (all the automation carp), wouldn't know how to plug a cable on the back of the tv, pretty sick, it's all because of business philosophy and the mankind of getting stuff easier, simpler carp, i hate this, it's making the society DUMB. All the hardcore communitis are vocal because they defend them selfs, harmed because the mainstream is the majority and just because of the majority they have an edge and greater influence, it's like a virus, only a few are immune to it.

That's why i keep buying nintendo's products, for what they provide primairly, the software, they know correct hardware is needed for that, i do not care about 3rd parties unless it's an exclusive.

What you learned is, never try to bring somet software on some hardware that wasn't designed for. Stop doing ports, stop doing derivatives, stop doing online version, that is ALL BUSINESS EXPLOITATION of the BRAND.

A great and respected studio Relic has experimented with Company of Heroes Online, ofcourse it was closed down , learn why, they're embarrased about it they don't want to even talk about it again.

Company of Heroes 2 a PC exclusive is coming in 2013, true to the original, and they learned, KEEP doing what you do best and what you do know, stop trying to copy-modify-paste.

Multiplatform francises/brands that have not been multiplatform from the beginning are a fundamentally flawed, period.

Edited by Stewox, 27 May 2012 - 09:37 AM.

[Plutonas]

Only when new engines come out.. eg unreal engine 4... But if wii U supports UE4, then... expect even more advanced engines than that, or an updated version of UE4.

The reason is, the chipset of wii U is modern and supports all this effects that up to date pc graphic cards support.... DX11.1 does not give anything new.. just a couple of improvements, so expect better graphics in PC, when dx12 comes out...

So I believe in 2-3 years, pc will have better graphics again... Because even if dx12 comes out next year, developers must support it... Even though.. There are not many games today, that support dx11 or dx11 graphics... Wii U will boost development in dx11 games... So wii U basically will impress us for the next 5-6 years

Edited by Orion, 27 May 2012 - 07:44 AM.

[Stewox]

Only when new engines come out.. eg unreal engine 4... But if wii U supports UE4, then... expect even more advanced engines than that, or an updated version of UE4.

The reason is, the chipset of wii U is modern and supports all this effects that up to date pc graphic cards support.... DX11.1 does not give anything new.. just a couple of improvements, so expect better graphics in PC, when dx12 comes out...

This is a pretty complex thing to address ... i will be as short as i can this time.

Everyone of you people think that UE4 is some kind of holy-engine of the ages that is going to struck the whole galaxy. Please stop thinking like that, those screenshots are without technical meaning, they prove some facts, but not enough, not at all to see what it will be on WiiU

The optimizations are not a simple thing as most people imagine, they need the most experience and knowledge, only a few companies are capable to fund and commercially release that, and to have the technical resources to successfuly experiment with that first, all of the other companies are just behind and come in later ...

How UE4 will work on WiiU is a question the screenshots do not specific the platform, and consoles rely on optimizations to get the most performance and capabilities out of them, it's all in tradeoffs, some developers take more performance than graphics. Some companies just don't have the technical skills ... a great example is gearbox software, they're not bad, but not the best, their animations are pretty bad and looking at the Alien's Colonial marines footage, graphically it could have been better, and how the stuff looks, it's standard gearbox, it doesn't make the game bad but still you can detect their effort put in those areas.

UE4 support for WiiU is not a question of working or not, it's a question of HOW IT IS WORKING, initially it's totally up to Epic's own effort put into the WiiU version of the engine, it's is their own standards of what is good enough and they'll ship version 1.0.

I just don't get people's way of thinking, software is not static, it's not just ON/OFF, it's complex, it's dynamic, it's dependant, it's efffffort, it can go into infinity how good it can be, there is no physical limit and you would call it "complete". Software companies make their own imaginary limits and then call it in double digit numbers, it's silly, that's just a commerical term, a brand, a marketing word, it doesn't mean anything, it's only a name, a reference. UE4 doesn't mean anything, we can comment it when we see it, it can be crap, it can be great, WiiU support might be great, might be crap too, who knows.

Epic games isn't going to make a perfect engine for one platform if they won't develop games for it, it's the devs of the game that take an engine and make it work as good as they can, most licensees will take UE4 and modify it to their needs.

UE4 can have DX11 support, can have tesselation, can have whatever, but HOW IT HAS IT... supporting something is not a matter of writting a line of code "init render_mode_DX11" done! ... no it's effort put into that, how good does it support is a matter how good the engine takes advantage of it, that takes time, time and effort and money and knowledge.

Every engine can support DX11 ... it can run in DX11 mode, and staying true to the statement, it's too simple, supporting it, doesn't mean it USES ALL of it's capabilities.

So I believe in 2-3 years, pc will have better graphics again... Because even if dx12 comes out next year, developers must support it... Even though.. There are not many games today, that support dx11 or dx11 graphics... Wii U will boost development in dx11 games... So wii U basically will impress us for the next 5-6 years

Nooo, you're wrong. PC hardware will be better instantly the WiiU comes out, PC hardware will be better instantly PS4 comes out, PC hardware will be better instantly X720 comes out.

Hardware is keeping up the moore's law, it's way ahead, game software is light-years behind. Software in games, is commerical, it's entertainment, with so many games, the people who are responsible for the drive of software and hardware are clearly overshadowed in all the mist.

Lives, security, safety don't rely on game software,bugs are only a consumer satisfaction issue.
Buggy hardware, can bring down the whole industry, can affect the enterprise, can affect the developers, it affects everyone, no matter what they do, that's why buggy hardware gets recalled if it's out of control, hardware parts get recycled or fixed, they don't recall games if they are buggy, software can be patched whatever it is wrong with it, but some don't care patching a lot, it's all

hardware companies cannot afford that, hardware is hardware, they cannot expect to exploit stupid people to buy it, if the hardware is buggy, nobody is going to be satisfied, the whole industry relys on them, they would get a lot of carp from the enterprise sector, hardware is useless unless it doesn't work perfectly, and they won't get anyone to buy it if it doesn't work, nothing will work well on buggy hardware, no market segment is tolerating that. Im speaking about processor's, graphic cards, the stuff that goes into PCs ... ofcourse that's why they make multiple segments, they have a whole team dedicated to enterprise just for that reason of keeping the dependants supported, remember the intel's faulty sata ports, the AMD's TLB bug ...

90% of the game developers aren't drivers of the industry, they're just parasites.

Then why'd you quote me?
PC and Consoles generate graphics in the same way.

There are no PC exclusives anymore.
And comparing an indie development to a AAAAAA Microsoft effort, would be silly.

What is AAAAAA microsoft effort ? They don't drive the industry, they're forced to do to serve the enterprise.

And what you're talking about with exclusives ? What's diablo 3 ? what's starcraft 2: hots ?, Company of Heroes 2 ?, ... Generals 2 ? All exclusives.

Edited by Stewox, 27 May 2012 - 12:23 PM.

[Nollog]

What is AAAAAA microsoft effort ? They don't drive the industry, they're forced to do to serve the enterprise.

And what you're talking about with exclusives ? What's diablo 3 ? what's starcraft 2: hots ?, Company of Heroes 2 ?, ... Generals 2 ? All exclusives.

It's a joke about a job posting they made.

Are those out yet?
You can find me a game similar enough to diablo 3 and starcraft 2 on a current generation console for comparison purposes?

[Stewox]

It's a joke about a job posting they made.

Are those out yet?
You can find me a game similar enough to diablo 3 and starcraft 2 on a current generation console for comparison purposes?

does it matter if they're out yet ...
one we mentioned was out days ago ... sc2: HOTS comes this year probably ... other 2 come early 2012 ... as a matter of fact console generations have nothing to do with pc games so i am not sure about what is your intent with comparin these very different worlds ... i never compare nintendos games wit PC games thats why i think for my self have been able to peacefully and effectively coexist ...

precisely explain your mentality behind your thinking so i can understand and reply further ... we might uncover the source of our disagreements which i welcome

------------
upd:
was that a serious question?
I've ended up confused my self.

upd2:
also another status report
currently im typing from a mobile device ... you can see why i dislike these devices both from a technical and practical standpoint, its hard to type here fast so excuse my english grammar.

Edited by Stewox, 27 May 2012 - 01:16 PM.