61 replies to this topic

[NintendoReport]

Too much good stuff coming out in 2015 for me to care anymore if this is the case. I thought this might be a nice late 2014 title. 

[GAMER1984]

Too much good stuff coming out in 2015 for me to care anymore if this is the case. I thought this might be a nice late 2014 title.

And this is what Nintendo gamers mean to many publishers. Seem like there was a decent following and excitment for wii u version. Still scares me. One day it all seems good and then one day we get a delay or we are not making games for Nintendo anymore.

[NintendoReport]

And this is what Nintendo gamers mean to many publishers. Seem like there was a decent following and excitment for wii u version. Still scares me. One day it all seems good and then one day we get a delay or we are not making games for Nintendo anymore.

I still plan on picking it up but man, that totally deflates my excitement for this game.

Edited by Sorceror12, 11 July 2014 - 09:48 AM.

[3Dude]

On the plus side SM has come out to say WiiU version using DX11 Features

To clarify for some folks wondering which one is cpu and which is gpu, or maybe a surprise for those who know enough to be thrown off by particular wordings

'Multi-threaded shadow rendering. DX11
support for mult-threaded shadow rendering
(via -DX11MT)'

This one is actually cpu bound and not gpu bound, despite seemingly being about rendering shadows.

Its actually about organizing draw calls into different thread groups... And not actually about the process of rendering the shadows itself. And that stuff comes from the cpu.

Turns out, the wii u is surprisingly good at this kind of thing. While polycounts and geometric complexity and number of things on screen are the domain of the gpu, wrangling the draw calls to, well, call upon that asset to be drawn comes from the cpu, and has been a bit of a thorn for awhile, particularly in middleware or pc environments where the layers that must be dealt with to make a call can create a massive overhead, cpu bottle necking the system and tanking frame rates. Its something d3d has started adressing, and something mantle is tackling head on.

Now, ALL consoles are good at this and have low overhead in comparison to pc. But this is a little special for wii u, being notably less powerful than its peers, and especially with the undeserved bum rap its humble little cpu gets.

Which is why this kind of thing is a bit of a big deal on wii u, as its (draw calls) cpu restricted. Sms gave a hint of this with pcars on wii u and its multi thread rendering, and then shin en blew it up with a tweet a few days ago. What really caught my attention was a response to the tweet that claimed draw call parity with an impressive 1st party ps4 game. Well, I checked into it ( you cant just believe random comments), and it actually panned out.

From the cpu, using multithread rendering, shin en gets 10,000 draw calls a frame @60fps.

Sucker punch themselves boasted about getting 10,000 draw calls a frame in the 30fps infamous second son on ps4.

http://www.dualshock...-our-jaws-drop/

Now, these are different kinds of games, with different overhead, so the draw calls are not directly comparable, and by no means does this mean polycount parity, as that is a job that goes to the gpu, this is just about the draw calls from the cpu.

BUT, even so, it is absolutely a pretty little feather the wii u, and that custom little 750 descendant, can wear with pride on its humble little hat.

[Rockodoodle]

was looking foward to this game for the fall... i have plenty to play as it stands now, so for me it's not a big deal other than this is a game i've wanted for a while. it's bad for nintendo in that it doesn't have much 3rd party support and this will lead to at least a few lost sales bc others will buy the version on another platform. so it's kind of a cycle here

[NintendoReport]

[Raiden]

To clarify for some folks wondering which one is cpu and which is gpu, or maybe a surprise for those who know enough to be thrown off by particular wordings

'Multi-threaded shadow rendering. DX11
support for mult-threaded shadow rendering
(via -DX11MT)'

This one is actually cpu bound and not gpu bound, despite seemingly being about rendering shadows.

Its actually about organizing draw calls into different thread groups... And not actually about the process of rendering the shadows itself. And that stuff comes from the cpu.

Turns out, the wii u is surprisingly good at this kind of thing. While polycounts and geometric complexity and number of things on screen are the domain of the gpu, wrangling the draw calls to, well, call upon that asset to be drawn comes from the cpu, and has been a bit of a thorn for awhile, particularly in middleware or pc environments where the layers that must be dealt with to make a call can create a massive overhead, cpu bottle necking the system and tanking frame rates. Its something d3d has started adressing, and something mantle is tackling head on.

Now, ALL consoles are good at this and have low overhead in comparison to pc. But this is a little special for wii u, being notably less powerful than its peers, and especially with the undeserved bum rap its humble little cpu gets.

Which is why this kind of thing is a bit of a big deal on wii u, as its (draw calls) cpu restricted. Sms gave a hint of this with pcars on wii u and its multi thread rendering, and then shin en blew it up with a tweet a few days ago. What really caught my attention was a response to the tweet that claimed draw call parity with an impressive 1st party ps4 game. Well, I checked into it ( you cant just believe random comments), and it actually panned out.

From the cpu, using multithread rendering, shin en gets 10,000 draw calls a frame @60fps.

Sucker punch themselves boasted about getting 10,000 draw calls a frame in the 30fps infamous second son on ps4.

http://www.dualshock...-our-jaws-drop/

Now, these are different kinds of games, with different overhead, so the draw calls are not directly comparable, and by no means does this mean polycount parity, as that is a job that goes to the gpu, this is just about the draw calls from the cpu.

BUT, even so, it is absolutely a pretty little feather the wii u, and that custom little 750 descendant, can wear with pride on its humble little hat.

Wii U being boss when people don't expect it

[NintendoReport]

the real problem is the Wii U has a much better library right now than the other consoles, the PS4 and Xbone NEED MORE GAMES!

[GAMER1984]

the real problem is the Wii U has a much better library right now than the other consoles, the PS4 and Xbone NEED MORE GAMES!

Well they are getting them ON TIME

[TheDoctor_13]

Well then. They can go f themselved then.

[Raiden]

Well then. They can go f themselved then.

Ah man don't be like that. Not Slightly Mads idea. It's namco. Don't punish SM for all that hard work because of Namco.

We still have a lot to look worward to so if anything they saved you some money for Christmas in December.

[TheDoctor_13]

Ah man don't be like that. Not Slightly Mads idea. It's namco. Don't punish SM for all that hard work because of Namco.

We still have a lot to look worward to so if anything they saved you some money for Christmas in December.

Didn't say that was aimed at SM. But the only reason why SM was making this game for Wii U was because nothing else was really on it, once it comes out, and the sales are butchered, probably mostly because Bandai Namco, and no more, if they even planned to support the Wii U further.

[KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

On the plus side SM has come out to say WiiU version using DX11 Features

 

Yeah that's great. Too bad I'll never see them since 100% of my hype has turned to anger and I will no longer be purchasing the game.

Guess my streak of never having a realistic racing game despite wanting one continues.

I just find it sad considering the Wii U ver was in development before the PS4 and Xboner versions. Now people aren't going to buy this game for the Wii U.

And once again when the sales are low people will try to point the finger at nintendo and us, its fans, and we're going have to have to try "make excuses" for their two faced-ness.

[Raiden]

Yeah that's great. Too bad I'll never see them since 100% of my hype has turned to anger and I will no longer be purchasing the game.

Guess my streak of never having a realistic racing game despite wanting one continues.

And once again when the sales are low people will try to point the finger at nintendo and us, its fans, and we're going have to have to try "make excuses" for their two faced-ness.

Stop having a temper tantrum. It's Namco not Slighty Mad.  Can't have your cake now..boo hoo. Slightly Mad put in a ton of work and Namco decided to delay it but I will stilly give SM support.

[KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

Stop having a temper tantrum. It's Namco not Slighty Mad.  Can't have your cake now..boo hoo. Slightly Mad put in a ton of work and Namco decided to delay it but I will stilly give SM support.

Copy paste what I put in my status here

Has that actually been confirmed? And then why not digital release at the same time as the others since Namco is only publishing physical copies? Also why take the deal if they know this is one of the conditions. Also didn't we all agree that it's unlikely Namco would cut Wii U users off at the knees since they're working closely with nintendo and don't have the same atrocious records as western companies? Also why did they say they need the time to "make it work" either they are being honest and they decided eff Wii U and its users or they're lying and decided eff Wii u and its users.

So in short, even if Namco ordered it, Slightly Mad certainly looks to be to blame as well.

[Raiden]

Bandai Namco’s statement reads: “We’re committed to delivering an exceptional and unique experience for racing fans on Wii U and for this we kindly ask our devoted and passionate Nintendo fans for a little more time in order to ensure the game delivers on our vision of being the most authentic, beautiful, and technically-advanced racing game on any platform.”

Read more at http://nintendoevery...rs-wii-u-delay/

 

Also remember the game was a lock in at November for all platforms and the minute Namco said they would publish it it gets delayed. Namco also the ones who released One Piece digital only on WiiU but physical on 3DS and PS3. It's def Namco doing Wiiery

[KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

Also remember the game was a lock in at November for all platforms and the minute Namco said they would publish it it gets delayed. Namco also the ones who released One Piece digital only on WiiU but physical on 3DS and PS3. It's def Namco doing Wiiery

That still leaves the fact that Slightly Mad willingly went with the deal. I find it very hard to believe that this could have happened without their go ahead since Bandai joined with them so late. Slightly had leverege. They either saw it in the contract/talked about it in talks and decided that the idea of more sales due to physical was worth effing us over or they or bandai didn't disclose and told them they wanted to delay after and Slightly Mad was just like "ok"

The only other possiblilty is Bandai is telling the truth and it's just bad timing.

Once again, very good chance Slighty Mad should take at least some of the blame. They let this happen.

Edited by WydrA, 11 July 2014 - 09:28 PM.

[Raiden]

That still leaves the fact that Slightly Mad willingly went with the deal. I find it very hard to believe that this could have happened without their go ahead since Bandai approached them.

Um Namco stepped in to publish which means they became the boss making the game physical. They can't exactly bite the hand that feeds them.  If They said no screw you Namco they are up a rainbow creek. Go ahead work somewhere with contract work and tell your boss to eff off and you do things how you want. See how far that goes. Slightly Mad has zero say so in the matter. Namco as publisher holds all the cards...that's whata publisher is you being at thier mercy.

Edited by Ryudo, 11 July 2014 - 09:34 PM.

[KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums]

Um Namco stepped in to publish which means they became the boss making the game physical. They can't exactly bite the hand that feeds them.  If They said no screw you Namco they are up a rainbow creek. Go ahead work somewhere with contract work and tell your boss to eff off and you do things how you want. See how far that goes. Slightly Mad has zero say so in the matter. Namco as publisher holds all the cards...that's whata publisher is you being at thier mercy.

I'm saying before they agreed for the game to be published by namco, they most likely would have been told this was a condition. They could have said "No, that's a crappy thing to do, we aren't doing that."

If they found out after, then even still they aren't actually their boss, and could say "that was not one of the terms we discussed. If you like you can release the physical late, but we see no reason to release the digital late." and done so. Also in this case the publisher doesn't hold all the cards. With most games, yes, they do because they are completely funding the game and hold the copyright and trademark for the game. You try to say, that's not gonna work for us and they cans say you're not gonna work for us, and pull all their funding from under your feet. 

That is not the case with project cars. Prject cars is already 100% fully funded. This deal with Namco is "you get money for physical copies, and we get a little from people who wouldn't have bought the digital for whatever reason, and the added advertising."

In other words this deal is just a way for both parties to make a little extra cash. In fact chances are Bandai has more to lose here than Slightly Mad, because I'm guessing Bandai is paying for 100% or very nearly that much of the physical publishing, with Project Cars getting a cut since they own the IP (another treason this is different from the usual publisher vs. dev case.

In other words, if the physical doesn't sell, Bandai takes huge losses. Slightly mad? Almost nothing to nothing. Plus they get their 100% of digital sales (as far as I know).

In other words, Slightly Mad doesn't have to take crap from anyone. They've already got their game made guaranteed, and chances are they'll make profit from digital. Chances also are they don't need the physical to make money. Bandai isn't "at their mercy" so to speak, but they certainly don't have as much power over Slightly mad as EA would over DICE or Bioware.

Slightly mad has decided to throw their Wii u users under the bus -one way or another- in the hopes they can make extra cash.

This is also putting both companies at risk, because as their site's poll said, 27 percent of people planning to buy the game? Wii u users. You just ticked a whole lot of them off. Slightly could actually end up LOSING this move, since they essentially are relying on Wii U users to roll over and suck dick and go out like good little abused wives and buy daddies game even though you're being treated like trash. If Wii U users decide not to take this, they no longer have their digital copy fall back. Now their relyign on physical copy sales, which as I just mentioned is not 100% their money. I should also mention a sizeable portion of these sales would fall into people who were going to buy the digital who switched over so they could get their hands on physical simply because they prefer it. Like me.

So now all their left with is the hope that random mommies see the game on their shelves and bring it home for their kiddies, and Xbox one, PS4 and PC sales. None of which had the same percentage of supporters.

Bandai is even worse off, because 100% of their profit was supposed to come from the physical. They really want those people who were switching over from digital because that's most likely their biggest "ensured" sales base. Now they're 100% reliant on unaware mommies and gamers, and people who don't care about being treated like second class pieces of crap.

does that sound like a good situation for either company to you?

So yes, it's possible Namco went all "We hate Wii u gamers, delay their game!" on Slightly mad (and put their own company at risk), and Slightly mad went "Oh no, how you do legal work? Me no know. Guess we no have leverage." like Lindasy Lohan in court and stupidly put their own company at risk as well.

It's more likely Namco went all "We hate Wii u gamers, delay their game!" on Slightly Mad (and put their own company at risk), and Slightly Mad went "We have leverage right?" "Yeah but who cares dude? If we shove it up Wii U owners' we could end up with even more money! Eff 'em, let's do it!" and willingly put their own company at risk, but banked on people just sucking their dicks anyway.

What I think is even more likely is Namco went "Hey, we're Namco Bandai, a company who has been working closely with Nintendo. We saw your game and thought, hey let's publish a physical for all platforms! This way we can both make some extra cash!" and Slightly Mad went "Yeah tat sounds great!" Then came back after the deal was done, and said "Hey you now the Wii U version, we decided to crap all over it and it's not done. How about some delay? Cool? Cool." And the fact the news came right after the deal was either "luck" or planned. I think this is most likely because how much Wii U footage have we actually seen? Oh yeah, absolutely none!

Anyway, 'm not claiming to be an expert in this or to have all the facts, but as far as I know that's how things probably went down. Maybe someone with more knowledge about this sort of thing like 3Dude can correct me on any mistakes I may have made.

[GAMER1984]

The only thing that irks me is this would NEVER happen to one of the other console makes. Has there EVER been a game that was delayed on either sony or microsoft consoles but came to the other console AND a nintendo console EVER?