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#21 Nollog

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 01:23 PM

Nah, just the opposite, if I understand you correctly. :)

Then your point seems to have reversed on you.

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#22 Gruff

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 01:58 PM

Then f**king buy it.

Yeah, let me go buy a track from a game like Kirby Super Star...


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#23 MatrixChicken

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 02:30 PM

Then your point seems to have reversed on you.

 

Huh... Must not have read your post correctly, then.


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#24 Auzzie Wingman

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 02:31 PM

illegal downloading hurts the music industry

 

fug fug fug, lemme clarify

 

I like downloading tunes that you can't buy. Like fanmade remixes and video game tracks. I didn't mean songs that you hear all the time on the radio.


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#25 Nollog

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 03:16 PM

fug fug fug, lemme clarify
 
I like downloading tunes that you can't buy. Like fanmade remixes and video game tracks. I didn't mean songs that you hear all the time on the radio.

Try bandcamp and spotify for those.

Yeah, let me go buy a track from a game like Kirby Super Star...

http://www.amazon.co...k/dp/B00AFOMYHS

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#26 Auzzie Wingman

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 03:18 PM

Alright cool, thanks Nollog.


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#27 xile6

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 04:30 PM

Do you really think that people like Justin Bieber are going to be hurt if every single person doesn't buy his song? No. Illegal downloading has been going on for years and I don't think the music industry has been hurt that much from it. And besides that, there are people like me who cannot buy some of there music and need a place to download it. I don't listen to most stuff on the radio, I usually listen too video game OST and what not, things that you usually cannot purchase.

all i have to say about this is the radio is free and long time ago people use to record it.

 

I dont truly understand the illegal download stuff.

True you could of gotten it from the store and paid some money and gotten a case booklet and disc that will get strached up.

Then the artist would of gotten some money. But i honestly thing they make more money doing shows then selling cds.

 

With all that being said.

If you like it and want to support the person for more to come then buy it and pay for it.

 

 

 

an no this isnt all aim at you villager. Just first i quoted and agreed with.


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#28 KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 04:47 PM

To be honest, if the song in question is uploaded (by the artist) anywhere where you can stream it, such as Soundcloud or YouTube, I see no legal issues with downloading it. The artist made it readily available to the internet for free, so there's no reason you can't have a copy of said music unless, of course, you sell it, or something, but why would you do that xD

 

If an artist requests money to dowload a song, there is no way you can justify downloading that song for free without their permission. A lot of work has gone into their music and if they want to be paid for it, you pay for it. Otherwise they would have made it free. When they put the song on soundcloud or youtubem they have put it there so it can be listened to on souncloud and youtube, not on your ipod or your computer's library. That's why youtube has an option to make music unavailable to mobile devices. So that people aren't getting cheated.

Illegal downloading really makes it hard for musicians. You want to share your music with people, but if you do people take it as license to steal it from you :/

all i have to say about this is the radio is free and long time ago people use to record it.

 

I dont truly understand the illegal download stuff.

True you could of gotten it from the store and paid some money and gotten a case booklet and disc that will get strached up.

Then the artist would of gotten some money. But i honestly thing they make more money doing shows then selling cds.

 

With all that being said.

If you like it and want to support the person for more to come then buy it and pay for it.

 

 

 

an no this isnt all aim at you villager. Just first i quoted and agreed with.

But with radios they cut deals. Most times to get played on the radio you have to be on a label, and that label usually has connections with the radio station, where it's a win win. The musicians get more exposure, and the Radio station gets more listeners. People recorded it, yes but the quality was balls, even if you could get through the song without being interrupted by pink noise. Also because people stole in the past it doesn't make it ok to steal now.

Yes, the big artists now make much more money doing shows than in sales. That's a well known undisputed fact. However for small artists, you can't just "book a show". To get a show worth anything booked you usually have to go through years and years and years of work, signing, collaborating and promoting.

As others said, even if you don't want to support the artist (though why you would be downloading music of an artist you don't want to support, I don't know), then when you steal from that artist you undercut the rest of the industry as well.

 

All in all I don't think you guys understand just how much bucking work goes into a song. Even the ones people think are easy like EDM are so far beyond what you could dream...


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#29 xile6

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 05:09 PM

If an artist requests money to dowload a song, there is no way you can justify downloading that song for free without their permission. A lot of work has gone into their music and if they want to be paid for it, you pay for it. Otherwise they would have made it free. When they put the song on soundcloud or youtubem they have put it there so it can be listened to on souncloud and youtube, not on your ipod or your computer's library. That's why youtube has an option to make music unavailable to mobile devices. So that people aren't getting cheated.

Illegal downloading really makes it hard for musicians. You want to share your music with people, but if you do people take it as license to steal it from you :/

But with radios they cut deals. Most times to get played on the radio you have to be on a label, and that label usually has connections with the radio station, where it's a win win. The musicians get more exposure, and the Radio station gets more listeners. People recorded it, yes but the quality was balls, even if you could get through the song without being interrupted by pink noise. Also because people stole in the past it doesn't make it ok to steal now.

Yes, the big artists now make much more money doing shows than in sales. That's a well known undisputed fact. However for small artists, you can't just "book a show". To get a show worth anything booked you usually have to go through years and years and years of work, signing, collaborating and promoting.

As others said, even if you don't want to support the artist (though why you would be downloading music of an artist you don't want to support, I don't know), then when you steal from that artist you undercut the rest of the industry as well.

 

All in all I don't think you guys understand just how much bucking work goes into a song. Even the ones people think are easy like EDM are so far beyond what you could dream...

I got 2 friends that do music. one of them i help make a lil music video. The other i lost touch with, but before i heard 2of his cds.

And i also have a friend that makes beats and had a small show on telemundo.

My friend has made over 100 copies of his cd just to give away because he wants more listener. He does shows ever once in a while at some clubs.

So i do know what goes into it and how things work.

 

All i am saying is its something digital. And always a copy. you hear it once you know it and its in your head so i dont see much harm in downloading it.

If there is a cd i want and wanna support the person i will go and buy it. Then rip it to my ipod or phone and put the disc up.

Its just how i see it.

 

it may be true that they dont get that money from the people they might have gotten it from but i believe the buyers out weight the downloaders


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#30 Arioch

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 05:12 PM

In the end, it doesn't apply much to me, as I usually only download stuff I actually listen to and will eventually buy.  The only instances where I cannot are when the disks or albums are old or foreign and cost over $50-$100, regardless of shipping, or if the album is not up for sale anywhere (The damn compilation album of IEM has been over $135 but now I think Wilson is actually doing an affordable rerelease soon).  Plus some of the bands are no longer existent and wont actually be making any money from the album purchased, like many prog-rock bands from the 70's to 90's (even then, I have bought albums in those cases because physical copies are so much more satisfying for something like that).

 

In some cases, like games, I don't think it should cost anything to have a copy of the music that is already in the game you (presumably) bought.

 

All in all I don't think you guys understand just how much bucking work goes into a song. Even the ones people think are easy like EDM are so far beyond what you could dream...

A fair amount of us actually do understand the process it takes.  However, that process is easier for pop stars with inflated egos or musicians who have been in the business long enough to build themselves and their resources up.

 

Also a quick note on youtube, once a song has been uploaded to youtube, that version is considered in the public domain and can be downloaded from that source completely legally.  That situation becomes a moral argument for you guys.



#31 Gruff

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 05:22 PM

Glad you found an OST for Kirby Super Star ULTRA, even though I said Kirby Super Star. And yes, there is a difference in the music between the two. I know, I played the hell out both of them.


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#32 KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 05:33 PM

I got 2 friends that do music. one of them i help make a lil music video. The other i lost touch with, but before i heard 2of his cds.

And i also have a friend that makes beats and had a small show on telemundo.

My friend has made over 100 copies of his cd just to give away because he wants more listener. He does shows ever once in a while at some clubs.

So i do know what goes into it and how things work.

 

All i am saying is its something digital. And always a copy. you hear it once you know it and its in your head so i dont see much harm in downloading it.

If there is a cd i want and wanna support the person i will go and buy it. Then rip it to my ipod or phone and put the disc up.

Its just how i see it.

 

it may be true that they dont get that money from the people they might have gotten it from but i believe the buyers out weight the downloaders

 

There is a HUGE difference between remembering a song in your head and actually listening to it on your Mp3/computer. Otherwise people would never bother to sell music in the first place. In other words if it's the same thing to you then why don't you just keep "listening" to it in your head rather than stealing it?

Also, I'm pretty certain the dowloaders outweigh the buyers these days.

In the end, it doesn't apply much to me, as I usually only download stuff I actually listen to and will eventually buy.  The only instances where I cannot are when the disks or albums are old or foreign and cost over $50-$100, regardless of shipping, or if the album is not up for sale anywhere (The damn compilation album of IEM has been over $135 but now I think Wilson is actually doing an affordable rerelease soon).  Plus some of the bands are no longer existent and wont actually be making any money from the album purchased, like many prog-rock bands from the 70's to 90's (even then, I have bought albums in those cases because physical copies are so much more satisfying for something like that).

 

In some cases, like games, I don't think it should cost anything to have a copy of the music that is already in the game you (presumably) bought.

 

A fair amount of us actually do understand the process it takes.  However, that process is easier for pop stars with inflated egos or musicians who have been in the business long enough to build themselves and their resources up.

 

Also a quick note on youtube, once a song has been uploaded to youtube, that version is considered in the public domain and can be downloaded from that source completely legally.  That situation becomes a moral argument for you guys.

The video game thing I can see. But even if an album costs $130 and you're getting it for free, you're stealing it. There have been songs I've loved that I couldn't afford, and I waited until I had the money to buy them. I respect the artists too much to steal from them.

Even little pieces of crap like Justin Bieber who I would assume does practically nothing, has a huge team behind him who put in endless hours of work to get him where he is. Even with better equipment music is never just "easier" to make. Yes everyone has small things they can do to make it slightly less efficient, but it's never easy going step in the studio press some buttons peace out. I've seen many big time producers say over and over again that it's not the equipment that makes their music good. It's the tens to hundreds of hours they put in each song, and the hundreds to thousands of hours of music theory and learning the trade before that. There's no short cutting that. In terms of legality, this comes back to the dilemma of sharing your music and being stolen from, or keeping it to yourself and giving up on your dream. I think that's an extremely unfair position to put anyone in.


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#33 Nollog

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 05:34 PM

I got 2 friends that do music. one of them i help make a lil music video. The other i lost touch with, but before i heard 2of his cds.
And i also have a friend that makes beats and had a small show on telemundo.
My friend has made over 100 copies of his cd just to give away because he wants more listener. He does shows ever once in a while at some clubs.
So i do know what goes into it and how things work.

Ask your friends about "Pandora".
I'm not friends with, but am in a crowd with a lot of Indie musicians, like BGC, c418 and some others.
Like I say I'm not claiming to know them personally, or to even get along with them. Music isn't my thing at all, and I make all my opinions known.

They have however voiced their opinions on illegal music, and how it hurts them.
And I can see it from their points of view.
A common thread between them is like you said.
You can ask to use their music in your youtubes or whatever and they don't mind so long as you tell people where to legally get their music.
It's advertising, in a way that helps everyone.


Glad you found an OST for Kirby Super Star ULTRA, even though I said Kirby Super Star. And yes, there is a difference in the music between the two. I know, I played the hell out both of them.

Point is you can probably find somewhere to buy any music if you try hard enough.
Hell if it's a NES game there's probably a soundtrack/bgm setting inside the game.

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#34 xile6

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 06:12 PM

Ask your friends about "Pandora".
I'm not friends with, but am in a crowd with a lot of Indie musicians, like BGC, c418 and some others.
Like I say I'm not claiming to know them personally, or to even get along with them. Music isn't my thing at all, and I make all my opinions known.

They have however voiced their opinions on illegal music, and how it hurts them.
And I can see it from their points of view.
A common thread between them is like you said.
You can ask to use their music in your youtubes or whatever and they don't mind so long as you tell people where to legally get their music.
It's advertising, in a way that helps everyone.


Point is you can probably find somewhere to buy any music if you try hard enough.
Hell if it's a NES game there's probably a soundtrack/bgm setting inside the game.

the ones that does beat. Say it sucks when someone steals there beats and passes it off as there own. They make good money on them. But they are also cool. If someone askes to use there beat or gives them all the credit for it they dont get upset like that.

But if someone just all out takes it and pushes it off as there own the it starts stuff.

They have sue someone before.

But i do see that to be a lil bit different since it the beat and no one really gives anyone credit for the beat vs the singer.

If a singer is putting there music out there on different free formats, then i dont understand the big problem.

You say you can buy video game sounds and songs. But what do you do when you already paid for the game? Shouldnt this include everything that is on that disc?

Or what if the game itself is free? Then you should still have to pay for the song?

There is a HUGE difference between remembering a song in your head and actually listening to it on your Mp3/computer. Otherwise people would never bother to sell music in the first place. In other words if it's the same thing to you then why don't you just keep "listening" to it in your head rather than stealing it?

Also, I'm pretty certain the dowloaders outweigh the buyers these days.

The video game thing I can see. But even if an album costs $130 and you're getting it for free, you're stealing it. There have been songs I've loved that I couldn't afford, and I waited until I had the money to buy them. I respect the artists too much to steal from them.

Even little pieces of crap like Justin Bieber who I would assume does practically nothing, has a huge team behind him who put in endless hours of work to get him where he is. Even with better equipment music is never just "easier" to make. Yes everyone has small things they can do to make it slightly less efficient, but it's never easy going step in the studio press some buttons peace out. I've seen many big time producers say over and over again that it's not the equipment that makes their music good. It's the tens to hundreds of hours they put in each song, and the hundreds to thousands of hours of music theory and learning the trade before that. There's no short cutting that. In terms of legality, this comes back to the dilemma of sharing your music and being stolen from, or keeping it to yourself and giving up on your dream. I think that's an extremely unfair position to put anyone in.

truly i do listen to music in my head.

I really only listen to music if its on something or the radio in the car.

My ipod thats plug into the car is fill with music i brought or was free to download.

I have some dpride on it and he upload his whole cd for download as long as you get it from his site.

But other then that i can listen to all the songs from youtube. And he sells his music also.

 

but what your saying is if im in my car and i make a youtube playlist of music. That i am then stealing it?

I would think not because its on a free site.

but then your say if i copy that music into a mp3 format then im stealing it also?

 

And you go on to say that you can see someone copying a game but not music because a game cost more?

I dont understand that one.

 

If you wanted a wii u game you would have to download a illegal copy and burn it to a disc and probably install a chip in the system.

With all this you could of brought the game and been done with it.

 

Vs a song that you heard on the radio, internet ad, tv show, movie, or even listening to right now for free on youtube.

But yet you should go to the store and pay $10-$20 for a cd when you only want one song.

But then your going to say you can just buy that one song for $1. But that makes no sense to me when you already have it because you listen to it on the above ^.


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#35 Nollog

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 06:27 PM

You say you can buy video game sounds and songs. But what do you do when you already paid for the game? Shouldnt this include everything that is on that disc?
Or what if the game itself is free? Then you should still have to pay for the song?

The game-makers pay the rights to broadcast the music in their game, like a radio pays for the right to broadcast the song over the air to their listeners.
You don't own either song in either case.
Yes.
Because it's not your song to have, as you haven't purchased it. You do have a copy of the music you have access to however.

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#36 Zinix

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 06:36 PM

this is against the rules


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#37 KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 07:37 PM

truly i do listen to music in my head.

I really only listen to music if its on something or the radio in the car.

My ipod thats plug into the car is fill with music i brought or was free to download.

I have some dpride on it and he upload his whole cd for download as long as you get it from his site.

But other then that i can listen to all the songs from youtube. And he sells his music also.

 

but what your saying is if im in my car and i make a youtube playlist of music. That i am then stealing it?

I would think not because its on a free site.

but then your say if i copy that music into a mp3 format then im stealing it also?

 

And you go on to say that you can see someone copying a game but not music because a game cost more?

I dont understand that one.

 

If you wanted a wii u game you would have to download a illegal copy and burn it to a disc and probably install a chip in the system.

With all this you could of brought the game and been done with it.

 

Vs a song that you heard on the radio, internet ad, tv show, movie, or even listening to right now for free on youtube.

But yet you should go to the store and pay $10-$20 for a cd when you only want one song.

But then your going to say you can just buy that one song for $1. But that makes no sense to me when you already have it because you listen to it on the above ^.

 

Like I said, while it might be legal, it doesn't mean it's right morally. The artists have a huge dilemma that they've been forced into. If you really have respect for that artist (or any artist really) you would respect that dilemma and that tehy obviously actually want you to pay for the music, and you would pay for it.

No I said the music from within the game, because I was thinking "if you pay for a game with music in it, you pay for the music as well" but Nollog made a good point, and so I've changed my opinion anyway now.


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#38 xile6

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 07:39 PM

Like I said, while it might be legal, it doesn't mean it's right morally. The artists have a huge dilemma that they've been forced into. If you really have respect for that artist (or any artist really) you would respect that dilemma and that tehy obviously actually want you to pay for the music, and you would pay for it.

No I said the music from within the game, because I was thinking "if you pay for a game with music in it, you pay for the music as well" but Nollog made a good point, and so I've changed my opinion anyway now.

yea and thats my basic is if like them support them.


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#39 KeptMyWiiUAndLeftTheForums

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 07:44 PM

yea and thats my basic is if like them support them.

Well like I and others said, if you steal even from those you don't like (though, once again, why you would be downloading music by someone you don't like is beyond me) you hurt those you do like and want to support.


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#40 Big Boss

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 07:47 PM

I can't afford to buy music. :(

 

so I use spotify. yay for not breaking the law!







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