72 replies to this topic

[Greg1040]

Thats because the games aint graphically as demanding as ps4 and xbox one game. Still looking good though

[GAMER1984]

Thats because the games aint graphically as demanding as ps4 and xbox one game. Still looking good though

 

 

give me your example of "graphically demanding"?

[Greg1040]

I was reffering to the comment before my post saying more wii u games are 1080p than next gen yet it being weake. I meant take a ps4 game and run it on the wii u it wouldnt handle it yet take a wii u game on ps4 would play it no bother

Btw im not hating on the wii u used to own 1

Edited by Greg1040, 20 October 2013 - 06:11 AM.

[Arkhandar]

Thats because the games aint graphically as demanding as ps4 and xbox one game. Still looking good though

 

It's still ironic though.

[Alex Atkin UK]

Except the Wii U the developers have had access to a mature development kit for at least 9 months, not the case for PS4/Xbone which by all accounts are struggling the same problem Wii U had before launch - its still heavily in flux.

 

Also, no PS4/Xbone games that I have seen are targeting for such small scale levels or art style as Nintendo, so they aren't remotely comparable.

 

Mario 3D World doesn't really look any greater scale than Mario 64 to me.  It stands to reason that if they keep the environments fairly small and cramped that they can then go nuts on the graphical detail.  Its a very good looking game, but its not having to contend with the sort of processing requirements that large scale worlds with realistic physics and the huge particle counts such as Knack is dealing with.  Which makes you question why its NOT 1080p.

 

Its such a shame Rare aren't what they used to be as I'm sure if they had been and launched a game like Kameo on Xbox One it would blow away the graphics of Mario 3D World.

[Arkhandar]

Except the Wii U the developers have had access to a mature development kit for at least 9 months, not the case for PS4/Xbone which by all accounts are struggling the same problem Wii U had before launch - its still heavily in flux.

 

Also, no PS4/Xbone games that I have seen are targeting for such small scale levels or art style as Nintendo, so they aren't remotely comparable.

 

Mario 3D World doesn't really look any greater scale than Mario 64 to me.  It stands to reason that if they keep the environments fairly small and cramped that they can then go nuts on the graphical detail.  Its a very good looking game, but its not having to contend with the sort of processing requirements that large scale worlds with realistic physics and the huge particle counts such as Knack is dealing with.  Which makes you question why its NOT 1080p.

 

Its such a shame Rare aren't what they used to be as I'm sure if they had been and launched a game like Kameo on Xbox One it would blow away the graphics of Mario 3D World.

 

Excuse me?

[Socalmuscle]

Excuse me?

lol.

tell me about it.

[storabajskorven]

The reason is probably that the development time would increase by a few months. Nintendo can't afford that.

[BrandedSwordsman]

This doesn't matter. Pretty visuals are expected with EAD Tokyo, but most importantly, perfect level design and timeless gameplay. 

[cupoftea]

it doesnt need 1080p its a good looking game and 1080p upscale on wiiu is crisp ,,,it keeps the file size small for easy eshop purchase

 

this game is huge looks amazing has loads going on and 4 players on screen @ 60 frames

 

yet its a 2GB file that is simply amazing 1080p may have uped the file size nintendo saeem to want this game packed in tightly likely for fast easy download

[NintendoReport]

it doesnt need 1080p its a good looking game and 1080p upscale on wiiu is crisp ,,,it keeps the file size small for easy eshop purchase

 

this game is huge looks amazing has loads going on and 4 players on screen @ 60 frames

 

yet its a 2GB file that is simply amazing 1080p may have uped the file size nintendo saeem to want this game packed in tightly likely for fast easy download

 

 

Don't forget the possibility of 4 players with the cherry power up doubling their player... 

[3Dude]

it doesnt need 1080p its a good looking game and 1080p upscale on wiiu is crisp ,,,it keeps the file size small for easy eshop purchase
 
this game is huge looks amazing has loads going on and 4 players on screen @ 60 frames
 
yet its a 2GB file that is simply amazing 1080p may have uped the file size nintendo saeem to want this game packed in tightly likely for fast easy download

Makes sense its only 2Gb, the textures are mostly tiny tiles HEAVILY repeated. Better than heavily compressed if you ask me. I suspect this is a purpoeeful decision precisely for keeping file sizes down, and download and install times more reasonable.

[Alex Atkin UK]

I always got the impression that Nintendo used a LOT of shaded polygons, avoiding the need for textures at all.

 

I'm not sure about current GPUs, but it used to be that if you used shaded polys you could render many many more of them on the screen than textured ones.  I believe you can also procedurally generate the textures using shaders these days, again saving on textures from disc.

 

With good art direction you don't need a lot of textures to make a good looking game, when that game world is entirely fictional and cartoony.  Its when you are trying to simulate the real world that you need detailed textures of everything.  I'm really looking forward to seeing how Watch Dogs deals with that, even if I am getting the PS4 version.

[3Dude]

I always got the impression that Nintendo used a LOT of shaded polygons, avoiding the need for textures at all.
 
I'm not sure about current GPUs, but it used to be that if you used shaded polys you could render many many more of them on the screen than textured ones.  I believe you can also procedurally generate the textures using shaders these days, again saving on textures from disc.
 
With good art direction you don't need a lot of textures to make a good looking game, when that game world is entirely fictional and cartoony.  Its when you are trying to simulate the real world that you need detailed textures of everything.  I'm really looking forward to seeing how Watch Dogs deals with that, even if I am getting the PS4 version.

Nothings changed, its still much faster to use untextured nonlit polygons than textured lit ones. Its the reason why the gamecube is still erroneously viewed as so weak. Sony and ms released figures for peak theoretical performance of unshaded, unlit polygons, while nintendo released numbers of lit, textured polygons, with conservative realworld numbers.... Making the gamecube appear, on paper to people who have no idea what they are reading very weak... Even the fact that the cube by far had the highest polycounts of its generation was enough to dispel the powerful halo effect of this myth.

Nintendo did do an untextured trick that with some character models o n64 to save on disc space and give a cartoon like appearence. But they havent done that in a while.

Shaders actually require maps in order to know what pixels to shade.

Texture maps have become rather dubiously named, it used to be, back when textures only had 1 layer, that all visual information was baked onto a single texture layer, that included colors, and shading and surface textures were drawn on, like you would do with a pencil. Now, that layer is broken up. The diffuse layer, which used to be everything, now only holds pigment colors, actual texture detail, is contained in a seperate map on the bump layer, this map is dual purpose, visually, its for humans to see what they are doing, but each pixel on that map is an adress of a 2d matrix which the computer uses as a guide for the shaders to.. well, shade.

'Shaders' is also a dubious term, while the units are definately used for shading, they are just simple arithitic logic units that can also be used to process general (as opposed to specialized) calculations as well. So while those same alu's COULD be used for procedural generation, they arent really shaders at that point in time... They are just making a 2d bit map to be stored in ram, and later be shaded by... shaders.

Nintendo has had procedural generation of geometry (used with tesselation in ww) and textures since gamecube (ps2 also had procedural generation, rockstar used it in state of emergency) and procedural texturing since cube (dont recall any game using it for texturing) Currently, both wii u and 3ds have procedural generation, Shin en uses it extensively to keep their gorgeous games at very small file sizes. Nintendo uses procedural generation of geometry for dynamic interaction between user and gameworld, stuff like the effect the sword has on enemies in zelda adventure.... I still havent seen any use of procedural texturing from nintendo. If 3dworld was, it would likely be considerably less than a Gb.

[Law212]

I cant believe how awesome the Wii U games look. I haven't been a Nintendo fan since SNES, but I bought a Wii U on a whim. I never liked the original Wii but I am hooked on the Wii U.

 

I love the New super Mario bros U + Luigi U, and im hyped for the new 3D Mario coming out in just over a week. (yeah im 32 and hyped for Mario) I even used EB games credit to buy the Mario and luigi Wii remote plus controllers!

 

Cant wait to play the new Mario kart, smash bros, bayonetta, and donkey kong. Also hoping for a new Star Fox one day. I've never played any Zelda games other than on the NES and my buddy gave me his Windwaker HD code so im looking forward to playing it.

 

ANyway long story short, I'm loving  the Wii U (minus lack of library) right now.

[3Dude]

Law212, on 15 Nov 2013 - 11:46 PM, said:
I cant believe how awesome the Wii U games look. I haven't been a Nintendo fan since SNES, but I bought a Wii U on a whim. I never liked the original Wii but I am hooked on the Wii U.

I love the New super Mario bros U + Luigi U, and im hyped for the new 3D Mario coming out in just over a week. (yeah im 32 and hyped for Mario) I even used EB games credit to buy the Mario and luigi Wii remote plus controllers!

Cant wait to play the new Mario kart, smash bros, bayonetta, and donkey kong. Also hoping for a new Star Fox one day. I've never played any Zelda games other than on the NES and my buddy gave me his Windwaker HD code so im looking forward to playing it.

ANyway long story short, I'm loving the Wii U (minus lack of library) right now.

You will find a lot of over 30's who came back to Nintendo. Particularly ones with kids. Its not to enforce the 'kiddy' stereotype... but other companies, they make kids games that are horrible, horroible design, horrible gameplay, horrible everything, they are bad games, because they pander to kids as second class consumers who arwe too 'dumb' to play 'real' games, so they make dumb games. Nintendo makes games that are acceptable for kids to play, and are great games of a high quality, well done enough that adults can enjoy playing them as well. Because they are gret games, made with the utmost effort, that are appropriate for children to play.

Glad you are enjoying your new wii u, its a pretty good time to pick one up, as it appears to finally be getting out of a rather nasty launch slump.

That being said, I take it you havent heard about.... X?

[namkotje]

After watching that footage again, either the game has a very good anti aliasing or it really is 1080p. I'm betting on the latter.

 

It's ironic that the Wii U has the most 1080p60 games than the other next gen systems (PS4 and Xbox One), despite being the "weaker" system.

 

Your game(platform games) doesn't need to have the best tech to look great. Beautiful Art-style does that.

Edited by namkotje, 16 November 2013 - 07:13 AM.

[Law212]

I have heard of X and look forward to it. But for now I have to make my way through Monster Hunter 3 and Windwaker HD. The wii U is a great system and I cant wait for almost all of the upcoming games. I even went out and bought the two Mario and Luigi themed Wii remotes.

You will find a lot of over 30's who came back to Nintendo. Particularly ones with kids. Its not to enforce the 'kiddy' stereotype... but other companies, they make kids games that are horrible, horroible design, horrible gameplay, horrible everything, they are bad games, because they pander to kids as second class consumers who arwe too 'dumb' to play 'real' games, so they make dumb games. Nintendo makes games that are acceptable for kids to play, and are great games of a high quality, well done enough that adults can enjoy playing them as well. Because they are gret games, made with the utmost effort, that are appropriate for children to play.

Glad you are enjoying your new wii u, its a pretty good time to pick one up, as it appears to finally be getting out of a rather nasty launch slump.

That being said, I take it you havent heard about.... X?

I have heard of X and look forward to it. But for now I have to make my way through Monster Hunter 3 and Windwaker HD. The wii U is a great system and I cant wait for almost all of the upcoming games. I even went out and bought the two Mario and Luigi themed Wii remotes.

You will find a lot of over 30's who came back to Nintendo. Particularly ones with kids. Its not to enforce the 'kiddy' stereotype... but other companies, they make kids games that are horrible, horroible design, horrible gameplay, horrible everything, they are bad games, because they pander to kids as second class consumers who arwe too 'dumb' to play 'real' games, so they make dumb games. Nintendo makes games that are acceptable for kids to play, and are great games of a high quality, well done enough that adults can enjoy playing them as well. Because they are gret games, made with the utmost effort, that are appropriate for children to play.

Glad you are enjoying your new wii u, its a pretty good time to pick one up, as it appears to finally be getting out of a rather nasty launch slump.

That being said, I take it you havent heard about.... X?

I have heard of X and look forward to it. But for now I have to make my way through Monster Hunter 3 and Windwaker HD. The wii U is a great system and I cant wait for almost all of the upcoming games. I even went out and bought the two Mario and Luigi themed Wii remotes.

You will find a lot of over 30's who came back to Nintendo. Particularly ones with kids. Its not to enforce the 'kiddy' stereotype... but other companies, they make kids games that are horrible, horroible design, horrible gameplay, horrible everything, they are bad games, because they pander to kids as second class consumers who arwe too 'dumb' to play 'real' games, so they make dumb games. Nintendo makes games that are acceptable for kids to play, and are great games of a high quality, well done enough that adults can enjoy playing them as well. Because they are gret games, made with the utmost effort, that are appropriate for children to play.

Glad you are enjoying your new wii u, its a pretty good time to pick one up, as it appears to finally be getting out of a rather nasty launch slump.

That being said, I take it you havent heard about.... X?

I haveave heard of X and look forward to it. But for now I have to make my way through Monster Hunter 3 and Windwaker HD. The wii U is a great system and I cant wait for almost all of the upcoming games. I even went out and bought the two Mario and Luigi themed Wii remotes.

 

Wow that just happened.....

Edited by Law212, 16 November 2013 - 02:46 PM.

[Zinix]

The Wii U games at 1080p 60 FPS are Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate, Wind Waker HD, Rayman Legends, Smash Bros 4, and Skylanders Giants/Swap Force (I think, don't quote me on that). Need for Speed was 720p 30 FPS. Bayonetta 2 and Mario Kart are confirmed 60 FPS, but unconfirmed what resolution. Mario Kart looks just as sharp as Wind Waker at Best Buy, but it may have been upscaled cause 3D World was also just as sharp.

Bayonetta 2 seems to be running in 1080p from what I've saw. 

[GAMER1984]

Bayonetta 2 seems to be running in 1080p from what I've saw. 

 

 

wouldnt surprise me a little bit even though most think wii u cant pull of that IQ, and framerate at that resolution.

Edited by GAMER1984, 16 November 2013 - 07:50 PM.